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Too little too late? The tweets has already led to action
by leptoniscool 6y ago
Too little too late? The tweets has already led to action
- throwaway829 6y agoBLM protests resulted in millions of dollars in damages and deaths. Who should we ban for enflaming those protestors?
- s3th 6y agoThe police officers responsible for the murders of countless innocent Black people.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoYou're implying that destroying innocent people's property and starting riots that lead to deaths, including 18 murders in Chicago alone on May 31st, is a justified response to an act of injustice, which is an absolutely irresponsible moral outlook, exhibiting morally elitist entitlement. In fact, it would be the 'incitement to riot' that the parent comment is referring to, that an impartial application of the proposed rule would identify as worthy of banning.
- sosborn 6y agoOne act of injustice, or centuries of injustice?
- CryptoPunk 6y agoAt what point does brutalizing innocent people become a justified response to injustice? The answer is at no point. Any way, from what I recall 350,000 white men died fighting for the Union, in a civil war to end an institution that had existed since the beginning of human culture, and that continued to be practiced all around the world into the 20th century until imperialist powers ended it.
- sosborn 6y agoI’m not justifying anything. I’m simply pointing out the absurd false equivalence.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoI thought the riots were about the abuse inflicted upon George Floyd. Sorry for not being adequately sensitive. I think you're over-reacting a bit and it shows misplaced priorities.
- bluntfang 6y ago>I thought the riots were about the abuse inflicted upon George Floyd. Ah yes the old "i can only remember 1 event at a time" defense
- CryptoPunk 6y agoYour accusation lacks the generosity of a benefit of the doubt. It could be the fact that George Floyd's death triggered the movement, that his character figured centrally in it, and hashtags of his name were the primary symbol of it. But instead you take the typical high handed approach of the moral elitist movement.
- bluntfang 6y agoso many words, so much lack of substance. If I believe your claims were genuine I may have been more generous, but you're woefully ill equipped to have this discussion if you think this is only about George Floyd.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoWhat an incredibly smug, intolerant response. Your extreme belligerence and indignation is totally irresponsible.
- andrewzah 6y agoEquating protests with riots is a bit nonsensical. We should consider how the police has treated black people for the last 100+ years, to start. Protests like these have been long overdue.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoI don't understand your point. There were widespread riots across the US during the summer of BLM, with many police forces standing down in the face of them. And your point about black people in no way justifies the indiscriminate violence perpetrated by the rioters.
- dang 6y agoPlease stop taking HN threads further into flamewar, as you did repeatedly in this thread and are doing repeatedly on the site elsewhere. Comments like e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25526385 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25526385 are unacceptable, for reasons which will be obvious to you once you review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. If you keep posting like that we will ban you. I'm not going to ban you right now because you've also posted some ok comments within recent memory, but the not-ok comments are seriously not ok. No more of this, please.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoSorry, I'll try to not incite flame wars. In my defense, anything related to these kinds of issues is highly likely to rouse emotions. The only way these topics can even brought up without a flame war is if every one agrees, and no one expresses a dissenting viewpoint. Just Food for Thought. But yes I could certainly have been less provocative.
- dang 6y ago> anything related to these kinds of issues is highly likely to rouse emotions. You can say that again! And yet the seemingly innocuous mandate of this site—gratification of intellectual curiosity—actually requires us all to work hard at not succumbing to that dynamic. If you think about it (well, when I think about it), two odd things follow from that: (1) this is a rather larger project than it seems; (2) it's actually doable.
- CryptoPunk 6y agoYes it is doable. I made a mistake in how I dealt with inflammatory comments, in responding in kind instead of reporting it. I wrongly assumed moderation was more lax, and the forum was more of a free-for-all, than they are.
- haram_masala 6y agoThey are anything but countless. There’s a specific number of unarmed Black people who are killed each year by police. That number is typically less than 30.
- 3131s 6y agoOP said innocent, not unarmed.
- AnHonestComment 6y agoDo you believe that many innocent blacks die in armed conflict with the police? Do you have any evidence for that? Also, that number still wouldn’t be countless — it’s a few hundred, tops. Though most of those deaths are people who were engaged in some sort of armed conflict at the time.
- machello13 6y agoSo we can quantify how many innocent unarmed people the government is allowed to kill each year, and I guess it's more than 30?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- conductr 6y agoI had this conversation earlier. I think it is a natural question to compare the two similar acts in terms of violent/destructive rioting. Especially so since they are individually representative of both ends of the growing political distance between left/right in our country. My logic is not perfect by any means but I see a key difference between; 1) BLM was a group of citizens protesting against what is essentially abuse of power/government and they want change. They want legislative action that holds cops accountable. Doesn't matter if you agree with it, but this cause and their right to protest is the most American thing I've seen in a long time. Sure, there are people that took it too far and protesting turned to rioting. But protesting for action and change are patriotic acts. 2) On the other hand, today's events are almost opposite. It's been driven/lead by senior members of government. Using lies and propaganda, conditioning a group of citizen sympathizers over a long period of time to distrust media, distrust opposing "facts" or anyone that disagrees with Trumps agenda. Weaponize this group of people to seize power and considerably fracture our democracy. It's the least patriotic and perhaps treasonous thing I could ever imagine. But they think they are the patriots. It's just so backwards to me.
- roenxi 6y agoYour logic is impeccable, but there is a lot of strawmaning and questionable assumptions. It seems likely that the entire political spectrum wants cops held accountable. It is a fairly non-partisan issue that corruption of the police is a massive problem. The right wing hates the idea of people not following the rules, and the left is usually suspicious of the police at best. And you've judging a right to protest about the corruption of the police force as morally American while protesting corruption in the electoral process is somehow unpatriotic. Those are both extremely civic things to be protesting, the equivalence is very strong. Both are core US principles of freedom and self governance. Also the idea that the right wing protestors are more organised than the left is extremely suspect. The left are stereotypically much more organised and mobilised for protest - left wing politics has a long and proud history of working effectively through mass movements. Protestors are one of the pools the left wing draws its candidates for (there is that wonderfully classic photo of Bernie Sanders being arrested, for example). Trump is a more iconic figurehead but the left has far more effective logistical and advocacy support around protests. BLM protest leaders quite possibly are going to be a part of the next generation of Democrat leadership.