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> Fascism does not see the problem, it is the problem. Nobody is even close to implementing a fascist system in America. This is the kind of thing people who d

> Fascism does not see the problem, it is the problem. Nobody is even close to implementing a fascist system in America. This is the kind of thing people who don't actually know anything about Fascism say. Trump was not a Fascist or even close to it. Stop falling into the tired rhetoric of the 20th century. New words are needed to name the problem. The name for the system that you need to start using is "Totalitarian Liberalism". The leader is less important than the sum total bureaucratic control that slowly and "rationally" usurps freedom, flexibility, and leisure time from society for the benefit of the people who have the most influence over policy. It is not a populist system that benefits the aristocracy and the working class by aligning corporate and state power in the national interest (fascism) nor a system that purports to benefit the working class by giving them the means of production (communism) - it is a system that works to benefit the existing rich by exploiting and undermining social divides, papering over them with rules and laws that marginalize the entire working class while setting it against itself.

dr_dshiv 6y ago
Why do you say Trump was not close to fascism? I thought the combination of populism + nationalism + law/order + charismatic leadership + monied interests was close to fascist.
notabee 6y ago
From: https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1 https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1 * strident, often exclusionary nationalism - ("America First") check. * fixation with national decline (real or perceived) and threats to the existence of the national community - ("MAGA") check. * embrace of paramilitarism - ("stand back and stand by") check. * led by an authoritarian leader who claims to embody the national will. - check. * protecting or elevating the rights of the national community above the rights of those seen as alien - ("build a wall", "I don't care, do u?") check. * removing obstacles to national unity and suppressing those seen as challenging it - (myth of "stolen" votes, "Deep State" narrative) check. * expanding the size and influence of the national state - (To be fair, this has been the military industrial complex for quite a long time. Nothing unique here) normalized/not unique here * often, also seeking to expand territory through armed conflict - (Also, already a characteristic of the U.S. forever war to protect its interests globally) normalized/not unique here Merriam-Webster: Definition of fascism 1. often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition 2: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control early instances of army fascism and brutality — J. W. Aldridge Don't know where you're getting your definition from.
- aksss 6y ago
  Using your example, I could make a pretty compelling case substituting in JFK. I think there has to be some form of evaluation not so easily bent to what one wants to see.
  - NikolaeVarius 6y ago
    Do it
NikolaeVarius 6y ago
Wrong, I am strongly against using terms like facist or nazi for the purpose of insulting or otherizing someone you do not like. However he clearly ticks the majority of elements of a Facist leader. You do not know what facism is.
8note 6y ago
> It is not a populist system that benefits the aristocracy and the working class by aligning corporate and state power in the national interest (fascism) But that's exactly Trumps presidency? Or at least what he was attempting. What you're missing is that fascism doesn't align ALL of the groups, just a fraction of each, and blames failures on the ones that aren't in that alignment
djsumdog 6y ago
That's a really amazing way of putting it. Thank you.

dr_dshiv 6y ago

Why do you say Trump was not close to fascism? I thought the combination of populism + nationalism + law/order + charismatic leadership + monied interests was close to fascist.

notabee 6y ago

From: https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1 https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1 * strident, often exclusionary nationalism - ("America First") check. * fixation with national decline (real or perceived) and threats to the existence of the national community - ("MAGA") check. * embrace of paramilitarism - ("stand back and stand by") check. * led by an authoritarian leader who claims to embody the national will. - check. * protecting or elevating the rights of the national community above the rights of those seen as alien - ("build a wall", "I don't care, do u?") check. * removing obstacles to national unity and suppressing those seen as challenging it - (myth of "stolen" votes, "Deep State" narrative) check. * expanding the size and influence of the national state - (To be fair, this has been the military industrial complex for quite a long time. Nothing unique here) normalized/not unique here * often, also seeking to expand territory through armed conflict - (Also, already a characteristic of the U.S. forever war to protect its interests globally) normalized/not unique here Merriam-Webster: Definition of fascism 1. often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition 2: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control early instances of army fascism and brutality — J. W. Aldridge Don't know where you're getting your definition from.

aksss 6y ago
Using your example, I could make a pretty compelling case substituting in JFK. I think there has to be some form of evaluation not so easily bent to what one wants to see.
- NikolaeVarius 6y ago
  Do it

NikolaeVarius 6y ago

Wrong, I am strongly against using terms like facist or nazi for the purpose of insulting or otherizing someone you do not like. However he clearly ticks the majority of elements of a Facist leader. You do not know what facism is.

8note 6y ago

> It is not a populist system that benefits the aristocracy and the working class by aligning corporate and state power in the national interest (fascism) But that's exactly Trumps presidency? Or at least what he was attempting. What you're missing is that fascism doesn't align ALL of the groups, just a fraction of each, and blames failures on the ones that aren't in that alignment

djsumdog 6y ago

That's a really amazing way of putting it. Thank you.