4 ms·

What can congress do? They're already blacklisted. The only thing left is to shoot your own foot. Maybe avoid that? I've seen nothing logical that came out of

What can congress do? They're already blacklisted. The only thing left is to shoot your own foot. Maybe avoid that? I've seen nothing logical that came out of Trumps silly blacklisting except cashing out on the reputation the US had for pennies on the dollar. China is destined to be Europe and the US combined in term of tech. Time will tell if their culture causes problem for them. Smart high intelligence people + strong work ethic + competition and not rent seeking by incumbents. They're only second to Israel in terms of average human intelligence. Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted.

rscho 6y ago
China is destined by US and European politicians to take power, because those in power are totally corrupt. This has nothing to do with the instrinsic abilities of respective populations. Same goes for Israel. And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians.
- absolutelyrad 6y ago
  > And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians. What IP did Huawei steal? 5G?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
marcus_holmes 6y ago
Suggesting that human intelligence varies by race is a very old, very debunked idea that no-one believes any more outside of some small racist cliques.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- absolutelyrad 6y ago
  If the math Olympiad is racist then so is fashion modelling and NFL. And I called it ethnicity/descent already.
  - xtian 6y ago
    That’s not sufficient evidence for the scale of the claim you’re making about basic human nature. Many other factors can explain China’s success much less the demographic composition of Math Olympiad participants.
- iso8859-1 6y ago
  Without mentioning how the intelligence is measured, how can you decide that it is racist? You're not assuming good faith.
- lldbg 6y ago
  I haven't seen any good studies debunking it, but neither have I seen any studies which prove it. That IQ is heritable and has a large genetic component however is "settled science" [a], and the current trend in behavioural genetics seems to be that a large swathe of cognitive and social behaviours are very heritable indeed. [a]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/
- dash2 6y ago
  I don't read the comment as suggesting that Chinese people are genetically smart - just that they are smart. That IQ varies by race or ethnicity is an established fact, not a debunked theory. The controversial question is why it varies - nature or the environment?
  - unityByFreedom 6y ago
    Nature vs nurture is an ancient argument. Science indicates both contribute, and IQ is a subjective measure of what's perceived as intelligent. It certainly isn't settled science that some ethnicities are more intelligent on average than others. That is some James Damore BS that can never be measured. And by the way, we are one human race, according to the scientific definition.
    - dash2 6y ago
      You are only right to the extent that IQ is indeed a "subjective measure". For example, there are IQ differences between black and white people in the US. See e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achievement_gaps_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achievement_gaps_in_the_United.... Debates about this take the form (a) of arguing about what IQ measures, and whether it is valid; (b) of arguing about whether environmental or genetic factors contribute to the differences - for instance, if you have worse nutrition, experience more air pollution, or have a less stimulating home environment, all of these might cause your IQ to be lower than someone else. However, there is no serious debate that the gaps in IQ tests (and many other achievement measures) exist. The debate about whether IQ is "subjective" is ongoing but some things are pretty clearly known. For instance, IQ is highly predictive of many life outcomes, and many different kinds of academic tests all load on a single factor (general intelligence). This has all been debated up and down the hillsides, and although I don't think IQ is the single measure that defines everything (obviously?), you are premature to dismiss IQ as "subjective". That's far from obvious.
      - unityByFreedom 6y ago
        Your thesis and supportive arguments contradict your conclusion.
- Geminidog 6y ago
  This comment should be voted down; it is inline with the current social attitudes in the US but it is scientifically not true. Nothing has been debunked. What we do know is IQ is heritable AND China has people with High IQ. Whether IQ is inherited for chinas case or whether IQ is a good quantitative measure for intelligence is not formally established but the parent-parent poster does not make an unrealistic proposition. I may get voted down on this but shame on people who voted this up for supporting a social ideal over the cold hard truth. Nothing has been debunked. Genetics control how we look physically across all races, there is no black magic that suddenly makes every race equal in intelligence and behavior while only controlling for physical differences. Uphold your social ideals but don’t let your ideals blind you from the cold hard truth.
  - marcus_holmes 6y ago
    it's not "cold hard truth" it's a right-wing white-supremacist dog whistle.
    - Geminidog 6y ago
      No it’s not. The biases that infect the white supremacist are just one side of the extremist coin. You live on the other side of extremism. Unable to see the scientific truth past your idealism. The white supremacist sees himself as superior even though reality says he clearly isn’t and you see everything as equal even though it clearly isn’t the case. The truth is far more complex. But that is irrelevant to you. You don’t care about the truth, you only care about defeating your enemy, the white supremacist. Thats why your childish response tries to turn the whole topic into a war against your personal enemy. Almost no one here is a white supremacist so your statement serves no one other than yourself. How can I say so much about your character without really knowing you? First off you made a huge logical error that reveals your biases. IQ scores do not make white people look good. They make Asians look smart. If anything IQ scores will be utilized by Asian supremacists NOT white supremacists. It is totally illogical to think that IQ scores are used by white supremacists when Asians have Superior scores. Yet here you are calling it a white supremacist dog whistle. Totally illogical. So why do you do it? Again the only reason here is because your statement serves your own personal biases. My advice to you is to to cast your biases aside and try to be more logical. You are a software engineer and logical thought is a required trait for all software engineers so it's good for you to train for this because clearly you lack training in this area.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
baja_blast 6y ago
> Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted. But conversely, if you look at winners of the Fields Medal, Abel Prize, Wolf Prize, Chern Medal etc. There is surprisingly few Chinese recipients despite outnumbering everyone else in total population.
- anglercut 6y ago
  > Chern Medal Self-explanatory, I think.

rscho 6y ago

China is destined by US and European politicians to take power, because those in power are totally corrupt. This has nothing to do with the instrinsic abilities of respective populations. Same goes for Israel. And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians.

absolutelyrad 6y ago
> And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians. What IP did Huawei steal? 5G?
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

marcus_holmes 6y ago

Suggesting that human intelligence varies by race is a very old, very debunked idea that no-one believes any more outside of some small racist cliques.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
absolutelyrad 6y ago
If the math Olympiad is racist then so is fashion modelling and NFL. And I called it ethnicity/descent already.
- xtian 6y ago
  That’s not sufficient evidence for the scale of the claim you’re making about basic human nature. Many other factors can explain China’s success much less the demographic composition of Math Olympiad participants.
iso8859-1 6y ago
Without mentioning how the intelligence is measured, how can you decide that it is racist? You're not assuming good faith.
lldbg 6y ago
I haven't seen any good studies debunking it, but neither have I seen any studies which prove it. That IQ is heritable and has a large genetic component however is "settled science" [a], and the current trend in behavioural genetics seems to be that a large swathe of cognitive and social behaviours are very heritable indeed. [a]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/
dash2 6y ago
I don't read the comment as suggesting that Chinese people are genetically smart - just that they are smart. That IQ varies by race or ethnicity is an established fact, not a debunked theory. The controversial question is why it varies - nature or the environment?
- unityByFreedom 6y ago
  Nature vs nurture is an ancient argument. Science indicates both contribute, and IQ is a subjective measure of what's perceived as intelligent. It certainly isn't settled science that some ethnicities are more intelligent on average than others. That is some James Damore BS that can never be measured. And by the way, we are one human race, according to the scientific definition.
  - dash2 6y ago
    You are only right to the extent that IQ is indeed a "subjective measure". For example, there are IQ differences between black and white people in the US. See e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achievement_gaps_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achievement_gaps_in_the_United.... Debates about this take the form (a) of arguing about what IQ measures, and whether it is valid; (b) of arguing about whether environmental or genetic factors contribute to the differences - for instance, if you have worse nutrition, experience more air pollution, or have a less stimulating home environment, all of these might cause your IQ to be lower than someone else. However, there is no serious debate that the gaps in IQ tests (and many other achievement measures) exist. The debate about whether IQ is "subjective" is ongoing but some things are pretty clearly known. For instance, IQ is highly predictive of many life outcomes, and many different kinds of academic tests all load on a single factor (general intelligence). This has all been debated up and down the hillsides, and although I don't think IQ is the single measure that defines everything (obviously?), you are premature to dismiss IQ as "subjective". That's far from obvious.
    - unityByFreedom 6y ago
      Your thesis and supportive arguments contradict your conclusion.
Geminidog 6y ago
This comment should be voted down; it is inline with the current social attitudes in the US but it is scientifically not true. Nothing has been debunked. What we do know is IQ is heritable AND China has people with High IQ. Whether IQ is inherited for chinas case or whether IQ is a good quantitative measure for intelligence is not formally established but the parent-parent poster does not make an unrealistic proposition. I may get voted down on this but shame on people who voted this up for supporting a social ideal over the cold hard truth. Nothing has been debunked. Genetics control how we look physically across all races, there is no black magic that suddenly makes every race equal in intelligence and behavior while only controlling for physical differences. Uphold your social ideals but don’t let your ideals blind you from the cold hard truth.
- marcus_holmes 6y ago
  it's not "cold hard truth" it's a right-wing white-supremacist dog whistle.
  - Geminidog 6y ago
    No it’s not. The biases that infect the white supremacist are just one side of the extremist coin. You live on the other side of extremism. Unable to see the scientific truth past your idealism. The white supremacist sees himself as superior even though reality says he clearly isn’t and you see everything as equal even though it clearly isn’t the case. The truth is far more complex. But that is irrelevant to you. You don’t care about the truth, you only care about defeating your enemy, the white supremacist. Thats why your childish response tries to turn the whole topic into a war against your personal enemy. Almost no one here is a white supremacist so your statement serves no one other than yourself. How can I say so much about your character without really knowing you? First off you made a huge logical error that reveals your biases. IQ scores do not make white people look good. They make Asians look smart. If anything IQ scores will be utilized by Asian supremacists NOT white supremacists. It is totally illogical to think that IQ scores are used by white supremacists when Asians have Superior scores. Yet here you are calling it a white supremacist dog whistle. Totally illogical. So why do you do it? Again the only reason here is because your statement serves your own personal biases. My advice to you is to to cast your biases aside and try to be more logical. You are a software engineer and logical thought is a required trait for all software engineers so it's good for you to train for this because clearly you lack training in this area.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

baja_blast 6y ago

> Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted. But conversely, if you look at winners of the Fields Medal, Abel Prize, Wolf Prize, Chern Medal etc. There is surprisingly few Chinese recipients despite outnumbering everyone else in total population.

anglercut 6y ago
> Chern Medal Self-explanatory, I think.