8 ms·

For the people that is arguing for a delayed dose. The issue at hand is we have 80% of the stock pile unused, there is currently no point in even applying this

by m3kw9 6y ago

For the people that is arguing for a delayed dose. The issue at hand is we have 80% of the stock pile unused, there is currently no point in even applying this tactic and taking unnecessary risk.

dehrmann 6y ago
While I think Trump botched the initial response to covid, it was so new and we had so little information that I'm not convinced Biden (or anyone else) would have done much better. Vaccine distribution is another matter. We knew this was coming, we knew we'd need cold storage, and there were only a few reasonable scenarios for who would be prioritized. Not getting out doses is the real failure, and not just Trump's; governors aren't doing great, either. The other failure was not preparing for a winter surge.
- curiousllama 6y ago
  It's just so variable across the board. Chicago is doing a _wonderful_ job; Florida is apparently botching it. I'm legit surprised Trump didn't hand the whole thing to the military. If there's one thing the military is good at, it's freaking logistics.
  - ars 6y ago
    > I'm legit surprised Trump didn't hand the whole thing to the military. If there's one thing the military is good at, it's freaking logistics. He did. Gen. Gustave Perna is in charge of vaccine distribution.
- blhack 6y ago
  How is it at all Trump's failure? The states have these doses, and it is the state health departments which are just refusing to give the vaccines to people out of "fairness". In my state, Arizona, the injection sites are open from 8-5 every day, and were closed on New Years Day. This is so far past frustrating to me that I don't have words for it. Get the fucking vaccines into people's arms YESTERDAY. Don't take one minute of rest until you have to as you wait to get resupplied. Here's a tracker: https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/ https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-glo... We were giving 400,000 vaccine doses. So far we have used 1/4 of them. 75% of our supply is sitting on a shelf while people go home every day at 5:00, or take a day off to celebrate the new year. Not acceptable. I just absolutely do not understand why these state health departments won't get going. For the love of god this is NOT the time to be taking vacation days. I just cannot even wrap my head around that. This pandemic is so awful that we are locking people in their homes, doing who knows what sort of damage to an entire generation of children, locking the elderly in nursing homes isolated from the world, destroying businesses, neglecting cancer treatments and screenings, and sprinting as fast as we can towards a collapsing economy. We have the solution sitting in a freezer. Instead of putting it into practice, people are going on vacation. Is this a catastrophic global pandemic or not? Why are people seriously taking VACATION time during something which is causing the collapse of our society? Here's a story from 5 days ago where a New Mexico man has had to sue for the ability to touch his wife (https://www.fox19.com/2020/12/31/husband-sues-right-touch-wife-nm-nursing-home-amid-covid-pandemic/ https://www.fox19.com/2020/12/31/husband-sues-right-touch-wi...). And people are going on vacation instead of solving this? They're going home at 5:00?
  - salmon30salmon 6y ago
    Thank you so much for saying this! I am beyond upset at my state for fucking this up so badly. We can't open schools but we can take time off and worry about equity over expediency? This is how my state views the vaccine: "OHA considers the planningfor COVID-19 vaccine to be an opportunity to reimagine how the agency engages communities in co-creating the work of public health. This vaccine plan, as mentioned above, is a starting point for this journey." Fuck this all. Get shots in the arms right fucking now
  - standardUser 6y ago
    States need money to establish and run a new and fast operation, money that was finally approved by Congress long after it should have been. Trump wasn't even involved in negotiations (too busy contesting the election with no evidence and/or golfing) and then he refused to sign the bill for several days because of surprise, last minute demands he decided to make (and then go back on, gaining nothing but losing us all time). A competent leader would have been all-in on the entire process. EDIT: It's also worth noting that these healthcare professionals you are attacking have been working under difficult conditions and at significant risk for most of a year and probably deserve either a) a bunch of extra pay that states cant afford on their own or b) some damn time off.
    - blhack 6y ago
      Which healthcare workers am I attacking exactly? That's a pretty unfair characterization of what I'm saying. In fact, I think I'm doing the exact opposite here. It's not healthcare workers who are holding these vaccines back.
      - standardUser 6y ago
        "this is NOT the time to be taking vacation days" "Instead of putting it into practice, people are going on vacation." Those "people" are the healthcare workers.
- root_axis 6y ago
  Well, it was effortlessly within his power to squash the anti-mask nonsense, instead he defended it for political reasons and I don't think any other president of any party would have done that.
usaar333 6y ago
That's a separate problem that needs to be debugged. [It sounds like there's distribution problems that may be temporary or may require vastly simplifying our distribution rules - e.g. just set up drive-thrus and tell any elderly person they can come because rules restricting access slow down vaccinations -- fwiw, we discovered the similar problems when we initially tried to restrict testing] However, once we fix that, we still have a problem of insufficient vaccine.
amanaplanacanal 6y ago
Should we eventually reach the point where there is a shortage of vaccine stocks it might make sense to revisit. As things are going it doesn’t seem likely though.
jsight 6y ago
Yes, this false choice is confusing the issue. The rules for who gets the vaccine and when are poorly thought out and are leading to us using 1/6 of the available doses. That's the thing that needs to be fixed.

by m3kw9 6y ago

For the people that is arguing for a delayed dose. The issue at hand is we have 80% of the stock pile unused, there is currently no point in even applying this tactic and taking unnecessary risk.

dehrmann 6y ago

While I think Trump botched the initial response to covid, it was so new and we had so little information that I'm not convinced Biden (or anyone else) would have done much better. Vaccine distribution is another matter. We knew this was coming, we knew we'd need cold storage, and there were only a few reasonable scenarios for who would be prioritized. Not getting out doses is the real failure, and not just Trump's; governors aren't doing great, either. The other failure was not preparing for a winter surge.

curiousllama 6y ago
It's just so variable across the board. Chicago is doing a _wonderful_ job; Florida is apparently botching it. I'm legit surprised Trump didn't hand the whole thing to the military. If there's one thing the military is good at, it's freaking logistics.
- ars 6y ago
  > I'm legit surprised Trump didn't hand the whole thing to the military. If there's one thing the military is good at, it's freaking logistics. He did. Gen. Gustave Perna is in charge of vaccine distribution.
blhack 6y ago
How is it at all Trump's failure? The states have these doses, and it is the state health departments which are just refusing to give the vaccines to people out of "fairness". In my state, Arizona, the injection sites are open from 8-5 every day, and were closed on New Years Day. This is so far past frustrating to me that I don't have words for it. Get the fucking vaccines into people's arms YESTERDAY. Don't take one minute of rest until you have to as you wait to get resupplied. Here's a tracker: https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/ https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-glo... We were giving 400,000 vaccine doses. So far we have used 1/4 of them. 75% of our supply is sitting on a shelf while people go home every day at 5:00, or take a day off to celebrate the new year. Not acceptable. I just absolutely do not understand why these state health departments won't get going. For the love of god this is NOT the time to be taking vacation days. I just cannot even wrap my head around that. This pandemic is so awful that we are locking people in their homes, doing who knows what sort of damage to an entire generation of children, locking the elderly in nursing homes isolated from the world, destroying businesses, neglecting cancer treatments and screenings, and sprinting as fast as we can towards a collapsing economy. We have the solution sitting in a freezer. Instead of putting it into practice, people are going on vacation. Is this a catastrophic global pandemic or not? Why are people seriously taking VACATION time during something which is causing the collapse of our society? Here's a story from 5 days ago where a New Mexico man has had to sue for the ability to touch his wife (https://www.fox19.com/2020/12/31/husband-sues-right-touch-wife-nm-nursing-home-amid-covid-pandemic/ https://www.fox19.com/2020/12/31/husband-sues-right-touch-wi...). And people are going on vacation instead of solving this? They're going home at 5:00?
- salmon30salmon 6y ago
  Thank you so much for saying this! I am beyond upset at my state for fucking this up so badly. We can't open schools but we can take time off and worry about equity over expediency? This is how my state views the vaccine: "OHA considers the planningfor COVID-19 vaccine to be an opportunity to reimagine how the agency engages communities in co-creating the work of public health. This vaccine plan, as mentioned above, is a starting point for this journey." Fuck this all. Get shots in the arms right fucking now
- standardUser 6y ago
  States need money to establish and run a new and fast operation, money that was finally approved by Congress long after it should have been. Trump wasn't even involved in negotiations (too busy contesting the election with no evidence and/or golfing) and then he refused to sign the bill for several days because of surprise, last minute demands he decided to make (and then go back on, gaining nothing but losing us all time). A competent leader would have been all-in on the entire process. EDIT: It's also worth noting that these healthcare professionals you are attacking have been working under difficult conditions and at significant risk for most of a year and probably deserve either a) a bunch of extra pay that states cant afford on their own or b) some damn time off.
  - blhack 6y ago
    Which healthcare workers am I attacking exactly? That's a pretty unfair characterization of what I'm saying. In fact, I think I'm doing the exact opposite here. It's not healthcare workers who are holding these vaccines back.
    - standardUser 6y ago
      "this is NOT the time to be taking vacation days" "Instead of putting it into practice, people are going on vacation." Those "people" are the healthcare workers.
root_axis 6y ago
Well, it was effortlessly within his power to squash the anti-mask nonsense, instead he defended it for political reasons and I don't think any other president of any party would have done that.

usaar333 6y ago

That's a separate problem that needs to be debugged. [It sounds like there's distribution problems that may be temporary or may require vastly simplifying our distribution rules - e.g. just set up drive-thrus and tell any elderly person they can come because rules restricting access slow down vaccinations -- fwiw, we discovered the similar problems when we initially tried to restrict testing] However, once we fix that, we still have a problem of insufficient vaccine.

amanaplanacanal 6y ago

Should we eventually reach the point where there is a shortage of vaccine stocks it might make sense to revisit. As things are going it doesn’t seem likely though.

jsight 6y ago

Yes, this false choice is confusing the issue. The rules for who gets the vaccine and when are poorly thought out and are leading to us using 1/6 of the available doses. That's the thing that needs to be fixed.