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Do you have any of those "good reasons" beyond "it's nonsense"? Most people who say things like that, in my experience, have lifted that opinion wholesale from

Do you have any of those "good reasons" beyond "it's nonsense"? Most people who say things like that, in my experience, have lifted that opinion wholesale from their undergrad psychology professors and have never read the man's work.

watwut 6y ago
Freud's penis envy would be best reason. The idea that if you claim family member sexually abused you, then you likely basically have crunch on him. Yeah, those are most popular easy things to point at, but the level of science at the time was "few patients and tons of imagination". We are further away now.
- Nav_Panel 6y ago
  > Freud's penis envy would be best reason. > The idea that if you claim family member sexually abused you, then you likely basically have crunch on him. I've never heard the latter idea, but the former seems pretty real. I've spoken with plenty of women, all completely unversed in Freudian theory, who've related experiences that sound quite a bit like "penis envy" (usually some sort of early childhood situation, Freud never intended it to be taken as descriptive of adult women).
  - ineedasername 6y ago
    To the extent that "penis envy" was ever a true assessment to beging with, it can be read much more easily as a desire for the same level of power in society that males had, not a desire for anything related to biology.
    - Nav_Panel 6y ago
      No, it's pretty much literally like "I had a desire to marry my mother for a brief weird period when I was a little girl, until I learned that I couldn't do that". It's not about "power in society" at all, it's about the genesis of gendered notions in the child which leads to shifting identifications and relationships with parents. As a result it is a feminist concern, but of an entirely different order. And this is all in Freud himself! He was woke to gender!
      - watwut 6y ago
        > I had a desire to marry my mother for a brief weird period when I was a little girl This is even dumber and only guy can think it is anything.
        Nav_Panel 6y ago
        ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ whatever you say (and to clarify, Lacan identified the literalism of the theory as a problem and abstracted the idea to the level of desire. The child wants whatever mommy desires, whatever will make her stick around, which may or may not be the literal penis. In many cases it isn't.)
    - coldtea 6y ago
      >a desire for the same level of power in society that males had And psychoanalysis has explored this too. Besides, some of that power though derives from and appears in nature (the easiest example would be physical power, allowing men to keep women down), and this difference can very well be mistakengly assotiated by the child with the visible difference of not having a penis. Also, it's not like there's not a very common occurence when boys declare they want to "marry their mother" or girls are in "love with dad", and not very real pathological relations of that kind that expand beyond the cute stage.
      - watwut 6y ago
        > this difference can very well be mistakengly assotiated by the child with the visible difference of not having a penis. No. It is taky stupid theory. Also, little girls of that age don't know much about penises. Unless you abused her sexually, she did not even seen that and knew very little about it. Height and strength are easy more visible. Cloth are easy more visible. Different behavioral expectations are visible and accepted. Penis, not so much. Penis is something young males are obsessed about as shown by their tendency to draw it a lot.

watwut 6y ago

Freud's penis envy would be best reason. The idea that if you claim family member sexually abused you, then you likely basically have crunch on him. Yeah, those are most popular easy things to point at, but the level of science at the time was "few patients and tons of imagination". We are further away now.

Nav_Panel 6y ago
> Freud's penis envy would be best reason. > The idea that if you claim family member sexually abused you, then you likely basically have crunch on him. I've never heard the latter idea, but the former seems pretty real. I've spoken with plenty of women, all completely unversed in Freudian theory, who've related experiences that sound quite a bit like "penis envy" (usually some sort of early childhood situation, Freud never intended it to be taken as descriptive of adult women).
- ineedasername 6y ago
  To the extent that "penis envy" was ever a true assessment to beging with, it can be read much more easily as a desire for the same level of power in society that males had, not a desire for anything related to biology.
  - Nav_Panel 6y ago
    No, it's pretty much literally like "I had a desire to marry my mother for a brief weird period when I was a little girl, until I learned that I couldn't do that". It's not about "power in society" at all, it's about the genesis of gendered notions in the child which leads to shifting identifications and relationships with parents. As a result it is a feminist concern, but of an entirely different order. And this is all in Freud himself! He was woke to gender!
    - watwut 6y ago
      > I had a desire to marry my mother for a brief weird period when I was a little girl This is even dumber and only guy can think it is anything.
      - Nav_Panel 6y ago
        ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ whatever you say (and to clarify, Lacan identified the literalism of the theory as a problem and abstracted the idea to the level of desire. The child wants whatever mommy desires, whatever will make her stick around, which may or may not be the literal penis. In many cases it isn't.)
  - coldtea 6y ago
    >a desire for the same level of power in society that males had And psychoanalysis has explored this too. Besides, some of that power though derives from and appears in nature (the easiest example would be physical power, allowing men to keep women down), and this difference can very well be mistakengly assotiated by the child with the visible difference of not having a penis. Also, it's not like there's not a very common occurence when boys declare they want to "marry their mother" or girls are in "love with dad", and not very real pathological relations of that kind that expand beyond the cute stage.
    - watwut 6y ago
      > this difference can very well be mistakengly assotiated by the child with the visible difference of not having a penis. No. It is taky stupid theory. Also, little girls of that age don't know much about penises. Unless you abused her sexually, she did not even seen that and knew very little about it. Height and strength are easy more visible. Cloth are easy more visible. Different behavioral expectations are visible and accepted. Penis, not so much. Penis is something young males are obsessed about as shown by their tendency to draw it a lot.