4 ms·

Actually, this is exactly what it's like to bootstrap a company these days. You scrape along with no success and no money for a long time before it grows into

Actually, this is exactly what it's like to bootstrap a company these days. You scrape along with no success and no money for a long time before it grows into something that can support you. Hitting the $1000/founder/month profit mark is a huge milestone since it means you can just barely squeak by without digging further into your personal savings. It means that if you can keep growing the business, you're going to win. You'll notice that it's a completely different game than starting with big VC. And as you mentioned, it doesn't fit a lot of people's definition of a "business". That's fine. Just remember that there is in fact another definition. Revenue Generation is still part of it, but it's not the end goal. Generating enough revenue to live comfortably on while minimizing the amount of time and effort you need to expend is the ultimate goal for a lot of us. In that context, a company that brings in $20k/month and runs on autopilot is the highest form of success. For a lot of people with different definitions, that would be classed as complete failure. Anyway, enough talk. I'm off to Scotland for a week or so to get some fresh air while my business runs itself without me.

mb21 15y ago
Thanks for the comments - this was my first HN post. I hope you didn't see it as being pessimistic - As someone who has started companies in the past and wants to do it again, I am trying to understand this new movement. I love the thought of building a self-running business. Is that realistic? Is that realistic statistically? $12,000 profit per month after taxes is not livable in the US, and probably not Canada. Continuing to grow past $1000/month doesn't mean you are going to win; it could mean you win for a little bit and then lose all at once when something goes wrong, or someone else decides your idea is good and scoops it up. Maybe, maybe not. Again, I don't know. I do know that you can live frugally and without a cushion for only so long if your dream involves a family. Pulling out of a phd program may be the right choice, but you are giving up on a tangible asset before you cross the finish line. Education isn't the be-all end all, but it still means something to a lot of people and that's a nice back up if your company doesn't work out. I noticed you live in Thailand now which was apparently your dream. That lowers your costs significantly. Congratulations on that and the success you've had! For me, living in a first world country changes the calculus. I'm not promoting the "big vc" route and I don't think YC invests in companies so the founders can make $20k/month and take vacations when they want. Your final point I'll assume wasn't trying to rub my face into the fact that you have this freedom that perhaps I don't have. Again, congratulations on your success, and I think I'm going to try out your web meeting product. cheers.
- 3pt14159 15y ago
  Guys, don't downvote self professed newbies without explaining why you are doing so.
- ekidd 15y ago
  $12,000/month after taxes is $144,000/year for a single founder company. U.S. median family income was $45,018/year before taxes in 2003. Even for programmers working in Silicon Valley, $144,000/year after taxes is pretty decent. For comparison purposes, if you sold your company for $3.6 million, invested the money at 4% above inflation, and lived off the real interest, you'd earn $144,000/year. Now, that's clearly not as nice as an $8.5 billion acquisition by Microsoft, but it's still pretty sweet. If nothing else, you can comfortably feed your family while working on a new startup. :-)
  - mb21 15y ago
    yes - typo. $1,000/month or 12k/year is not livable in the US. Thanks for pointing this out. I actually did reread the post, but pre-coffee.
    - ChuckMcM 15y ago
      $1,000/month is great beer money. How much work goes into day to day operations? One of the things to keep in mind that if something 'only' makes $1,000/month but only takes two or three days out of your time a month its "effectively" paying you $15K - $20K/month because you have those other days to do something else. People who set up linkbait pages (I'm looking at you content farms) which bring in 4x their operating cost just replicate the crap out of them.
      - mb21 15y ago
        1k/month before taxes :( If you are already doing a full time job in software dev, you are probably paying 30-40% tax already.
- Spyro7 15y ago
pnathan 15y ago
I have to say, the kind of business you mention (20k/month & autopilot) would likely be my dream 'job'.
- padmanabhan01 15y ago
  He said runs on auto pilot.
- mb21 15y ago
  20k/month revenue or profit?

mb21 15y ago

Thanks for the comments - this was my first HN post. I hope you didn't see it as being pessimistic - As someone who has started companies in the past and wants to do it again, I am trying to understand this new movement. I love the thought of building a self-running business. Is that realistic? Is that realistic statistically? $12,000 profit per month after taxes is not livable in the US, and probably not Canada. Continuing to grow past $1000/month doesn't mean you are going to win; it could mean you win for a little bit and then lose all at once when something goes wrong, or someone else decides your idea is good and scoops it up. Maybe, maybe not. Again, I don't know. I do know that you can live frugally and without a cushion for only so long if your dream involves a family. Pulling out of a phd program may be the right choice, but you are giving up on a tangible asset before you cross the finish line. Education isn't the be-all end all, but it still means something to a lot of people and that's a nice back up if your company doesn't work out. I noticed you live in Thailand now which was apparently your dream. That lowers your costs significantly. Congratulations on that and the success you've had! For me, living in a first world country changes the calculus. I'm not promoting the "big vc" route and I don't think YC invests in companies so the founders can make $20k/month and take vacations when they want. Your final point I'll assume wasn't trying to rub my face into the fact that you have this freedom that perhaps I don't have. Again, congratulations on your success, and I think I'm going to try out your web meeting product. cheers.

3pt14159 15y ago
Guys, don't downvote self professed newbies without explaining why you are doing so.
ekidd 15y ago
$12,000/month after taxes is $144,000/year for a single founder company. U.S. median family income was $45,018/year before taxes in 2003. Even for programmers working in Silicon Valley, $144,000/year after taxes is pretty decent. For comparison purposes, if you sold your company for $3.6 million, invested the money at 4% above inflation, and lived off the real interest, you'd earn $144,000/year. Now, that's clearly not as nice as an $8.5 billion acquisition by Microsoft, but it's still pretty sweet. If nothing else, you can comfortably feed your family while working on a new startup. :-)
- mb21 15y ago
  yes - typo. $1,000/month or 12k/year is not livable in the US. Thanks for pointing this out. I actually did reread the post, but pre-coffee.
  - ChuckMcM 15y ago
    $1,000/month is great beer money. How much work goes into day to day operations? One of the things to keep in mind that if something 'only' makes $1,000/month but only takes two or three days out of your time a month its "effectively" paying you $15K - $20K/month because you have those other days to do something else. People who set up linkbait pages (I'm looking at you content farms) which bring in 4x their operating cost just replicate the crap out of them.
    - mb21 15y ago
      1k/month before taxes :( If you are already doing a full time job in software dev, you are probably paying 30-40% tax already.
Spyro7 15y ago

pnathan 15y ago

I have to say, the kind of business you mention (20k/month & autopilot) would likely be my dream 'job'.

padmanabhan01 15y ago
He said runs on auto pilot.
mb21 15y ago
20k/month revenue or profit?