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FWIW Edward Snowden is slightly guilty of fishing in a way. He didn't just collect relevant documents, he collected a massive cache of documents and instead of

FWIW Edward Snowden is slightly guilty of fishing in a way. He didn't just collect relevant documents, he collected a massive cache of documents and instead of vetting them himself (someone who is at least vaguely cleared to read the documents) he turned all of it over to the press to review instead.

sradman 6y ago
Right, Snowden and Manning sit on a similar spectrum in terms of unauthorized copying of classified documents. Snowden, seemed to have foreknowledge of an actual crime or at least the government failing to follow a reasonable person’s expectation of it following a given law.
2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
I wish Snowden didn't flee the country. I'd have a completely different opinion if he stood trial.
- jarbus 6y ago
  I doubt he'd receive a fair trial; No way the government would let an unbiased judge rule over him
- Miner49er 6y ago
  He didn't already sacrifice enough of his life? You aren't satisfied unless he gave all of it?
  - sradman 6y ago
    It doesn't have to be about just deserts, it can be about ethics. This argument is the main thrust of Plato's dialogue Crito [1]: > In Crito, Socrates believes injustice may not be answered with injustice, personifies the Laws of Athens to prove this, and refuses Crito's offer to finance his escape from prison. The dialogue contains an ancient statement of the social contract theory of government. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crito https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crito
- ComputerGuru 6y ago
  I think he didn’t care much about your opinion of him so much as he did about what would happen to him and where he’d end up. Given what was being kept from the American people and what he knew, it’s impossible to call him paranoid or to even pass judgement on his character. He may not have been willing to give his literal life for the sake of blowing the whistle, but there really can be no question that he did give up his life to do so.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
    He didn't follow whistleblower procedure and fled to an adversary. If he believes he is being noble then he should stand trial in good faith. Best case he wins and gets off, worst case he does jail and is proven right.
    - monocasa 6y ago
      Hes afforded almost no whistleblower protections since he was a contractor. https://www.pogo.org/analysis/2016/09/busting-myth-of-whistleblower-protections-for-ic-contractors/ https://www.pogo.org/analysis/2016/09/busting-myth-of-whistl... The espionage act under which he'd be charged doesn't allow a public good defense to be used in court. https://www.justiceinitiative.org/voices/why-snowden-won-t-get-public-interest-defense-he-deserves https://www.justiceinitiative.org/voices/why-snowden-won-t-g... What you're asking for structurally can't happen in the US legal system.
      - 2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
        Well then you write a report and send it to Congress members as a sign of good faith. I just really don't like fleeing. Now that he fled he is fucked and looks guilty.
        monocasa 6y ago
        The congress members are part of the problem, as he's gone over. They approved the illegal problems and were looking to bury public mention once they figured out all the scope of the programs since they were implicated and didn't want blowback during their own elections. You keep saying you "don't like fleeing", but you haven't provided an alternative that would both provide real change and not have him being threatened with the prospect of a firing squad.

sradman 6y ago

Right, Snowden and Manning sit on a similar spectrum in terms of unauthorized copying of classified documents. Snowden, seemed to have foreknowledge of an actual crime or at least the government failing to follow a reasonable person’s expectation of it following a given law.

2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago

I wish Snowden didn't flee the country. I'd have a completely different opinion if he stood trial.

jarbus 6y ago
I doubt he'd receive a fair trial; No way the government would let an unbiased judge rule over him
Miner49er 6y ago
He didn't already sacrifice enough of his life? You aren't satisfied unless he gave all of it?
- sradman 6y ago
  It doesn't have to be about just deserts, it can be about ethics. This argument is the main thrust of Plato's dialogue Crito [1]: > In Crito, Socrates believes injustice may not be answered with injustice, personifies the Laws of Athens to prove this, and refuses Crito's offer to finance his escape from prison. The dialogue contains an ancient statement of the social contract theory of government. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crito https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crito
ComputerGuru 6y ago
I think he didn’t care much about your opinion of him so much as he did about what would happen to him and where he’d end up. Given what was being kept from the American people and what he knew, it’s impossible to call him paranoid or to even pass judgement on his character. He may not have been willing to give his literal life for the sake of blowing the whistle, but there really can be no question that he did give up his life to do so.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
  He didn't follow whistleblower procedure and fled to an adversary. If he believes he is being noble then he should stand trial in good faith. Best case he wins and gets off, worst case he does jail and is proven right.
  - monocasa 6y ago
    Hes afforded almost no whistleblower protections since he was a contractor. https://www.pogo.org/analysis/2016/09/busting-myth-of-whistleblower-protections-for-ic-contractors/ https://www.pogo.org/analysis/2016/09/busting-myth-of-whistl... The espionage act under which he'd be charged doesn't allow a public good defense to be used in court. https://www.justiceinitiative.org/voices/why-snowden-won-t-get-public-interest-defense-he-deserves https://www.justiceinitiative.org/voices/why-snowden-won-t-g... What you're asking for structurally can't happen in the US legal system.
    - 2OEH8eoCRo0 6y ago
      Well then you write a report and send it to Congress members as a sign of good faith. I just really don't like fleeing. Now that he fled he is fucked and looks guilty.
      - monocasa 6y ago
        The congress members are part of the problem, as he's gone over. They approved the illegal problems and were looking to bury public mention once they figured out all the scope of the programs since they were implicated and didn't want blowback during their own elections. You keep saying you "don't like fleeing", but you haven't provided an alternative that would both provide real change and not have him being threatened with the prospect of a firing squad.