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We still very much live in a Foucauldian world: - we're constantly surveilled (school, jobs, gov't) and mostly we willingly submit to this - r.e. "21st centur

We still very much live in a Foucauldian world: - we're constantly surveilled (school, jobs, gov't) and mostly we willingly submit to this - r.e. "21st century is no longer a disciplinary society", yes it is, see my point above. we (they?) just succeeded in making the discipline less overt, more complicit. we don't need jails anymore we just need smartphones (see Social Dilemma) - that list is not one of an "achievement society", rather, one of a consumption society lubricated by surveillance (masquerading as individualism, success etc) Oui very much live in a Foucauldian world!

l33tbro 6y ago
You've missed the point - which is often the problem with posting quotes. I agree that we still live in a Foucauldian world and that many of those factors remain. But what Han is getting at (and his broader thesis in 'The Burnout Society') is that a new series of societal dynamics have propogated from the modern citizen's raison d'etre of serving one's own aspiration, rather than that of the collective. In Han's view, we live in a society where the Other is disappearing. This, in turn, creates all kinds of mental artifacts that hinder our overall experience and well-being.
- syndacks 6y ago
  Hey br0, appreciate the thoughtful response. > a new series of societal dynamics have propogated from the modern citizen's raison d'etre of serving one's own aspiration, rather than that of the collective. Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying in my points (if you exclude the 'discipline' part of them). Not sure I agree with Han's lack of The Other...see American politics, European politics but hey I guess I have to read the Burnout Society (thanks for rec) and debate ole Han, not you.
  - l33tbro 6y ago
    It's funny. I re-read it after posting that quote. A lot of his ideas very similar to Baudrillard. Especially stuff to do with the Other and difference. That being said, he still manages to have a pretty original perspective (to me, at least). His books are very difficult book to track down (the English translations especially). But you're welcome to borrow my copy: cutt.ly/jjs6mL0 (I will delete this in a day)

l33tbro 6y ago

You've missed the point - which is often the problem with posting quotes. I agree that we still live in a Foucauldian world and that many of those factors remain. But what Han is getting at (and his broader thesis in 'The Burnout Society') is that a new series of societal dynamics have propogated from the modern citizen's raison d'etre of serving one's own aspiration, rather than that of the collective. In Han's view, we live in a society where the Other is disappearing. This, in turn, creates all kinds of mental artifacts that hinder our overall experience and well-being.

syndacks 6y ago
Hey br0, appreciate the thoughtful response. > a new series of societal dynamics have propogated from the modern citizen's raison d'etre of serving one's own aspiration, rather than that of the collective. Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying in my points (if you exclude the 'discipline' part of them). Not sure I agree with Han's lack of The Other...see American politics, European politics but hey I guess I have to read the Burnout Society (thanks for rec) and debate ole Han, not you.
- l33tbro 6y ago
  It's funny. I re-read it after posting that quote. A lot of his ideas very similar to Baudrillard. Especially stuff to do with the Other and difference. That being said, he still manages to have a pretty original perspective (to me, at least). His books are very difficult book to track down (the English translations especially). But you're welcome to borrow my copy: cutt.ly/jjs6mL0 (I will delete this in a day)