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Not that I'm anti-EV, but it's probably worth noting that EVs like Tesla's are both heavier and more torquey than the average ICE econobox. They might be causi

Not that I'm anti-EV, but it's probably worth noting that EVs like Tesla's are both heavier and more torquey than the average ICE econobox. They might be causing more than their fair share of road wear. Especially considering you can treat every stop as a drag race in relative silence.

adrianN 6y ago
If you want to tax according to wear, almost every car is pretty much free and trucks become insanely expensive. Road wear is something like axle weight to the fourth power.
brianwawok 6y ago
Road wear is like cubic? With vehicle weight. Would take 10000 Tesla’s to wear the road the same as one truck. https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weight-vs-road-damage-levels/ https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weigh... If you want to EV tax me for road wear fine. Please tax trucks at least 1000x, and please tax all gas burning cars for the lung cancer and other negative externalities they cause.
- ByteJockey 6y ago
  Yeah trucks are subsidized because without them most populated areas wouldn't have food, and people tend to like food. Also basically every every other material good. I think people would probably scream pretty loud if food suddenly jumped in price 10x, but maybe we could handle it like most places handle sales tax? Exempt trucks carrying food/necessities and tax everything else.
  - vkou 6y ago
    Most trucks don't deliver food. And if that sort of tax policy would severely impact the cost of food, we'd be better off with direct subsidies for groceries.
  - Wowfunhappy 6y ago
    > Yeah trucks are subsidized because without them most populated areas wouldn't have food, and people tend to like food. The cost of transportation should just be included in the good. That way, if someone comes up with an ingenious new method of urban farming or something, they'll get rewarded in the market for cost savings.
- akira2501 6y ago
  > Would take 10000 Tesla’s to wear the road the same as one truck. Did you consider the weight for the full vehicle, or per-axle? The per-axle figure is the relevant one and would probably flatten that figure out quite a bit. They are also much more stringently enforced on commercial transportation vehicles, which require annual inspections and serious preventative maintenance to pass which does already add to the cost of operating these vehicles. Their per-mile consumption is higher as well, which aside from being bad for the environment, already means they are consuming much more fuel and paying a higher tax as it is. > tax all gas burning cars for the lung cancer and other negative externalities they cause. Transportation, on the whole, accounts for 28% of greenhouse gasses... but it also enables the society that we live in and our own personal mobility within it. Electricity is nearly the same at 27%. You can shift the source, but you cant eliminate greenhouse gas from our way of life.
dawnerd 6y ago
At least here, those tiny cars are also the ones running studded tires in Portland when we rarely get snow let alone ice where studs are needed. That absolutely is destroying our roads but we don't seem to care to tax them more.
guerby 6y ago
A Volkswagen PASSAT is pretty similar in size with a Model 3 SR+ and weights ... the same. https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-volkswagen-passat-viii+(2)+2.0+tdi+190+elegance+4motion+dsg7-2019.html https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-volkswagen... => length 4.78m, weight 1635kg https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-tesla-model+3-standard+rwd+plus-2019.html https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-tesla-mode... => length 4.69m weight 1612kg
- pengaru 6y ago
  Comparing AWD to RWD seems hardly fair, but you have a point; all modern cars are heavy pigs. The dual-motor AWD variant Model 3 comes in at 1847kg (4072lbs), which is pretty damn heavy for a car in my NA Miata-driving book. Also no PASSAT is going to rip sub-4s 0-60 launches from every stop.
  - guerby 6y ago
    Note on the weight comparison: AWD EV do have two or more motors (I've not seen models with only one motor but may be I missed one). AWD petrol cars only have one motor, just more transmission axes/gearboxes, so little impact on weight. AWD model 3 does have a 50% bigger battery though.

adrianN 6y ago

If you want to tax according to wear, almost every car is pretty much free and trucks become insanely expensive. Road wear is something like axle weight to the fourth power.

brianwawok 6y ago

Road wear is like cubic? With vehicle weight. Would take 10000 Tesla’s to wear the road the same as one truck. https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weight-vs-road-damage-levels/ https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weigh... If you want to EV tax me for road wear fine. Please tax trucks at least 1000x, and please tax all gas burning cars for the lung cancer and other negative externalities they cause.

ByteJockey 6y ago
Yeah trucks are subsidized because without them most populated areas wouldn't have food, and people tend to like food. Also basically every every other material good. I think people would probably scream pretty loud if food suddenly jumped in price 10x, but maybe we could handle it like most places handle sales tax? Exempt trucks carrying food/necessities and tax everything else.
- vkou 6y ago
  Most trucks don't deliver food. And if that sort of tax policy would severely impact the cost of food, we'd be better off with direct subsidies for groceries.
- Wowfunhappy 6y ago
  > Yeah trucks are subsidized because without them most populated areas wouldn't have food, and people tend to like food. The cost of transportation should just be included in the good. That way, if someone comes up with an ingenious new method of urban farming or something, they'll get rewarded in the market for cost savings.
akira2501 6y ago
> Would take 10000 Tesla’s to wear the road the same as one truck. Did you consider the weight for the full vehicle, or per-axle? The per-axle figure is the relevant one and would probably flatten that figure out quite a bit. They are also much more stringently enforced on commercial transportation vehicles, which require annual inspections and serious preventative maintenance to pass which does already add to the cost of operating these vehicles. Their per-mile consumption is higher as well, which aside from being bad for the environment, already means they are consuming much more fuel and paying a higher tax as it is. > tax all gas burning cars for the lung cancer and other negative externalities they cause. Transportation, on the whole, accounts for 28% of greenhouse gasses... but it also enables the society that we live in and our own personal mobility within it. Electricity is nearly the same at 27%. You can shift the source, but you cant eliminate greenhouse gas from our way of life.

dawnerd 6y ago

At least here, those tiny cars are also the ones running studded tires in Portland when we rarely get snow let alone ice where studs are needed. That absolutely is destroying our roads but we don't seem to care to tax them more.

guerby 6y ago

A Volkswagen PASSAT is pretty similar in size with a Model 3 SR+ and weights ... the same. https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-volkswagen-passat-viii+(2)+2.0+tdi+190+elegance+4motion+dsg7-2019.html https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-volkswagen... => length 4.78m, weight 1635kg https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-tesla-model+3-standard+rwd+plus-2019.html https://www.lacentrale.fr/fiche-technique-voiture-tesla-mode... => length 4.69m weight 1612kg

pengaru 6y ago
Comparing AWD to RWD seems hardly fair, but you have a point; all modern cars are heavy pigs. The dual-motor AWD variant Model 3 comes in at 1847kg (4072lbs), which is pretty damn heavy for a car in my NA Miata-driving book. Also no PASSAT is going to rip sub-4s 0-60 launches from every stop.
- guerby 6y ago
  Note on the weight comparison: AWD EV do have two or more motors (I've not seen models with only one motor but may be I missed one). AWD petrol cars only have one motor, just more transmission axes/gearboxes, so little impact on weight. AWD model 3 does have a 50% bigger battery though.