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Western Union is also very useful, but the vast majority of transactions are not made by Western Union because it has tradeoffs that make other things like cred

Western Union is also very useful, but the vast majority of transactions are not made by Western Union because it has tradeoffs that make other things like credit/debit cards and checks a better option. Bitcoin Evangelists are trying to pump up the price by advocating that bitcoin will be the best method of making payments for a huge variety of use cases. I'm not going to call it a pump and dump scam because I think that a lot of these people truly think that it is going to 500k and beyond and that they will never need to dump it all.

tluyben2 6y ago
WU is very expensive though; btc, if you know what you are doing, does not come close. WU is a horrible but unavoidable evil for millions of workers worldwide. This is one of the cases that should be disrupted.
- dkersten 6y ago
  Yeah, I had to transfer a few hundred dollars between Australia and Eurpoe last year and both bank transfer and WU would have cost a lot more and taken longer than using btc. With bitcoin, the transfer was complete in about 30 minutes and due to price volatility, I was able to cash out when the price was up enough to cover all fees. It was definitely very helpful.
- jiggawatts 6y ago
  I just checked, it seems that WU charges approximately 1% for transfers relative to the nominal exchange rate. I don't transfer money much, but superficially that doesn't seem too expensive considering the volatility risk to WU due to fluctuating exchange rates combined with the overheads of regulatory requirements. It seems to me that Bitcoin is only as cheap as it is because it sidesteps those regulatory overheads. So it's great, I suppose, as long as everyone is fine with it being used to launder money from human trafficking, the drug trade, corruption, or whatever...
  - 55555 6y ago
    IME, the real fees charged by WU often add up to 10-20%.
    - jiggawatts 6y ago
      How? The pricing calculator literally says $0.00 fees for me, the only charge is the 1% spread on the exchange rate.
      - tluyben2 6y ago
        I know WU from the dropoff points where cheap labour bring their money to send home; they use an extremely bad conversion rate. Like paypal but even worse. Sources: official WU dropoff points in HK, SG, TH, NL and ES. The exchange rates + fees are indeed 10-20% removed from what they really are. Maybe if you send online it is 1%, but most use it to bring cash (from cleaning houses etc) to families abroad. Edit: > The pricing calculator literally says Please go to a meatspace WU point and compare the conversion rates with the inter bank rates.
        jiggawatts 6y ago
        I don't think you'd be able to convert some weak currency from cash to cash in another weak currency efficiently with Bitcoin either. Last time I checked, its API didn't extend to collecting wads of bills! I know a lot of immigrants that send money home, they all use bank-to-bank transfers. Whether they use WU or not, the overheads seem to be in the 1% range...
        tluyben2 6y ago
        Bank to bank sure, WU is much higher in all cases I have seen. But he, we are just some people on the internet. I can send you pics of conversion tables in WU cash points in HK which are off by 5-20% from the inter bank rate. Banks can do this cheaply (and you still get screwed with most banks but indeed 1-2%, not 5+) so WU definitely does something bad there.
bigphishy 6y ago
bitcoin has beaten western union, international wire transfers for years now and will continue to do so as notoriety and adoption of crypto-asset grows. However, that in no way justifies its marketcap, which is just over 500 billions. However overvalued it is, and however many times the price crashes dramatically, it is likely that the blockchain will continue to exist in 50-100 years. As long as computers and the internet still exist that is.

tluyben2 6y ago

WU is very expensive though; btc, if you know what you are doing, does not come close. WU is a horrible but unavoidable evil for millions of workers worldwide. This is one of the cases that should be disrupted.

dkersten 6y ago
Yeah, I had to transfer a few hundred dollars between Australia and Eurpoe last year and both bank transfer and WU would have cost a lot more and taken longer than using btc. With bitcoin, the transfer was complete in about 30 minutes and due to price volatility, I was able to cash out when the price was up enough to cover all fees. It was definitely very helpful.
jiggawatts 6y ago
I just checked, it seems that WU charges approximately 1% for transfers relative to the nominal exchange rate. I don't transfer money much, but superficially that doesn't seem too expensive considering the volatility risk to WU due to fluctuating exchange rates combined with the overheads of regulatory requirements. It seems to me that Bitcoin is only as cheap as it is because it sidesteps those regulatory overheads. So it's great, I suppose, as long as everyone is fine with it being used to launder money from human trafficking, the drug trade, corruption, or whatever...
- 55555 6y ago
  IME, the real fees charged by WU often add up to 10-20%.
  - jiggawatts 6y ago
    How? The pricing calculator literally says $0.00 fees for me, the only charge is the 1% spread on the exchange rate.
    - tluyben2 6y ago
      I know WU from the dropoff points where cheap labour bring their money to send home; they use an extremely bad conversion rate. Like paypal but even worse. Sources: official WU dropoff points in HK, SG, TH, NL and ES. The exchange rates + fees are indeed 10-20% removed from what they really are. Maybe if you send online it is 1%, but most use it to bring cash (from cleaning houses etc) to families abroad. Edit: > The pricing calculator literally says Please go to a meatspace WU point and compare the conversion rates with the inter bank rates.
      - jiggawatts 6y ago
        I don't think you'd be able to convert some weak currency from cash to cash in another weak currency efficiently with Bitcoin either. Last time I checked, its API didn't extend to collecting wads of bills! I know a lot of immigrants that send money home, they all use bank-to-bank transfers. Whether they use WU or not, the overheads seem to be in the 1% range...
        tluyben2 6y ago
        Bank to bank sure, WU is much higher in all cases I have seen. But he, we are just some people on the internet. I can send you pics of conversion tables in WU cash points in HK which are off by 5-20% from the inter bank rate. Banks can do this cheaply (and you still get screwed with most banks but indeed 1-2%, not 5+) so WU definitely does something bad there.

bigphishy 6y ago

bitcoin has beaten western union, international wire transfers for years now and will continue to do so as notoriety and adoption of crypto-asset grows. However, that in no way justifies its marketcap, which is just over 500 billions. However overvalued it is, and however many times the price crashes dramatically, it is likely that the blockchain will continue to exist in 50-100 years. As long as computers and the internet still exist that is.