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> With so many bitter stories to share about his Tesla experience, Chan said he likes the cars despite how the company treated him over these years. This minds

> With so many bitter stories to share about his Tesla experience, Chan said he likes the cars despite how the company treated him over these years. This mindset just baffles the hell out of me. Why? Just...why? You're paying a staggering amount of money for something that's broken from the start and the seller's response is "well, that sucks, doesn't it?" and you turn around and still like what you got sold? All of the hassle involved in buying a car, new or used, is a big reason why my family didn't replace our last one when it went out of service. It's disappointing that an "all-new entrant" to the automaker scene like Tesla falls into the same sort of take-it-or-leave-it stuff that used car lots have long been known for.

rconti 6y ago
I remember being so disappointed, when I was finally able to buy my first-ever new car, to find out that you CAN'T really get it the way you want it, not anymore. Too many decades of Americans buying whatever car happens to be sitting on the lot today (usually in silver paint with beige interior) means that most vehicles aren't available with any real selection of options (they're typically packaged together), no interesting paint colors, and dealers that are uninterested in finding what you actually want. It's staggering to me that people apparently feel they don't have any power to get what they want when laying out a huge chunk of money.
- shuckles 6y ago
  It's possible to configure a car to your specifications, but you have to find a dealer willing to commit their order quota to it and wait a few months for the car to arrive. Do not expect much haggling if you take this path.
  - Technically 6y ago
    What's the value of a dealership to the consumer?
  - toast0 6y ago
    Yes, but depending on the manufacturer, you might not have nearly as many options as you might like. And then it sometimes comes wrong anyway. Source: ordered a 2017 Chrysler Pacifica. Couldn't order 15" wheels with premium trim. Ordered a spare tire, and got the built-in vacuum instead (this worked out OK, the donut spare, ordered separately, fits under in the middle seat stowage, if you finagle it). Still would have prefered 15" wheels over 17" or whatever we had to order, but not enough to buy new wheels. Would not recommend buying that early in the model cycle, but that's somewhat separate from ordering; except that they had no Pacificas on the lot to sell anyway, so it wasn't too hard to convince them to order one.
    - rconti 6y ago
      Yeah, that's a good example. My Golf R only had 2 option packages to choose from. Can't get a sunroof. Can't get a spare tire, even though it fits. (order the parts at retail from Europe at a HUGE retail markup, install them yourself). Something like 5 color choices. No wheel options. Can't get the great cloth seats available in Europe.
      - shuckles 6y ago
        It seems like this thread is missing the history of mass car manufacturing entirely, which began with a single SKU for the Model T. Customization to your heart’s content was never the strength. Especially for non-luxury brands. Try working through a Porsche configuration: you can select the color of the stitching!
        fomine3 6y ago
        It's interesting that US car culture still affected from Model T. At least in Japan, any car (except commercial vehicle) is somewhat or very customizable for interior/exterior even in $10k.
  - 93po 6y ago
    Heck, even just ordering a Macbook Air M1 with a terabyte SSD yesterday showed that it was going to take a month to get to me
- jacobkg 6y ago
  Same! What’s especially misleading is that most of the car manufacturer websites have a “Build your own” tool where you can select the features and options that you want, only to discover that no cars exist in that configuration.
  - sprite 6y ago
    Just go to the dealer and spec the car like you want it, put a deposit down and wait a few months for it to arrive. If you want something bespoke you can't expect it to be in inventory.
  - niffydroid 6y ago
    I generally buy Nissan because the local dealer is good. Generally the base models have what people want, it's only fancy interior or exterior add-ons that make you wait. Base models have ac, sat nav, cameras etc already. Generally you don't have to wait too long because the car is already built or there is one to that spec being built soon. I think the most I had to wait was 2 months
  - tpetry 6y ago
    I don‘t get the problem. In germany you go to a desler and tell them you want this specific configuration, you sign a contract and 3-4 months later your specific build is delivered to the dealery.
    - TheMog 6y ago
      Most car dealers in the US, at least for “normal” (ie, non-premium) car brands are extremely reluctant to custom order cars and often outright refuse to do so. They also tend to put subtle pressure on customers to buy something of the lot right now instead. The car buying experience is very different over here compared to Germany.
0goel0 6y ago
A part of that could be that no one wants to accept they paid a lot for a broken product. It hurts the ego.
rainyMammoth 6y ago
For some reason this type of behavior is very specific to Tesla. There is something to be said about feeling as part of a community (or as some would say, a cult).
cavisne 6y ago
There is simply no car that compares if you like tech. And there is no other practical (ie road trips) EV in the US. These stories tend to be outliers, most people don’t know what a panel gap is and would never think to measure the ground clearance.
- miked85 6y ago
  > most people don’t know what a panel gap is and would never think to measure the ground clearance. That doesn't excuse poor engineering. You also might measure ground clearance if you can't park your car: " His car has a 12 cm (4.7 in) ground clearance, which will not allow him to enter his parking spot – hence his concern about it. "
- foepys 6y ago
  What exactly does make Tesla a tech company compared to other car manufacturers? Nearly all car manufacturers have adaptive cruise control somewhere in their lineup - they just don't claim to reach FSD with the currently used hardware. But almost all are actively researching FSD with different hardware. Making EVs doesn't make you a tech company. ICE are even more complicated than electric engines and Tesla doesn't make their batteries themselves. I'm getting strong WeWork vibes from Tesla's claim to be a tech company.
  - abc_lisper 6y ago
    I have test driven a few cars before ending up with a model 3. Autopilot really takes the edge off and handles the car with confidence . No other car came close then, and was the only car then providing software updates which would make it even better. Tesla is no wework ..
    - tempestn 6y ago
      I have trouble understanding how autopilot could be relaxing. You have to be constantly vigilant lest it drive you into a concrete barrier or parked truck—yes those events are highly unlikely, but that would just make it more difficult to stay focused. And if I have to be entirely focused on the road anyway, why not just guide the car myself?
alacombe 6y ago
Look at Apple fanboys, screwed over years after years, but still waiting in lines to buy the new iShit.
14 6y ago
Yes his attitude baffled me as well. I won’t buy Dodge products because as a back yard mechanic they are the vehicle that has let me down the most. They have ghost issues that are near impossible to track down and fix. Transmission issues. Electrical issues. I could rant all day. I finally saved up and went with a Toyota and now feel comfortable driving long distances again and know I should be good for several hundred thousand miles. I honestly believe Tesla is playing with fire with this poor quality control. They may get away with it for now but I promise as they grow if they don’t address these issues you will have the opposite of a fan club and people who hate your product and promote others to their friends. I have convinced several people not to buy dodge/Chrysler. They are cheap to but cheaply made as well and guaranteed to let you down. Will Tesla become the next Dodge?
sbierwagen 6y ago
It's in the very next paragraph? >“In Hong Kong, any new car demands a 100 percent tax. Electric cars had no tax, so I bought the Model S and the Model X. Now we have to pay a 25-percent tax on EVs, which is still lower than with regular combustion-engined vehicles, but what will happen to the company when these incentives are over? Will people still want to buy cars that seem to come from a junkyard?” He's not complaining about the service, because the car is half the price of any other car. It's like complaining that a Chevrolet Aveo is small and the engine is underpowered.
- thatguy0900 6y ago
  "As for the Model 3 he was not able to refuse, Chan said he paid for the EV but cannot use it. The Hong Kong Service Center said he would have to wait until mid-February to pick up his car. Only by then they would be able to fix some of the issues he spotted. His Model X is also at the Service Center, which left him pretty much on foot." he doesn't even have what he paid for though

rconti 6y ago

I remember being so disappointed, when I was finally able to buy my first-ever new car, to find out that you CAN'T really get it the way you want it, not anymore. Too many decades of Americans buying whatever car happens to be sitting on the lot today (usually in silver paint with beige interior) means that most vehicles aren't available with any real selection of options (they're typically packaged together), no interesting paint colors, and dealers that are uninterested in finding what you actually want. It's staggering to me that people apparently feel they don't have any power to get what they want when laying out a huge chunk of money.

shuckles 6y ago
It's possible to configure a car to your specifications, but you have to find a dealer willing to commit their order quota to it and wait a few months for the car to arrive. Do not expect much haggling if you take this path.
- Technically 6y ago
  What's the value of a dealership to the consumer?
- toast0 6y ago
  Yes, but depending on the manufacturer, you might not have nearly as many options as you might like. And then it sometimes comes wrong anyway. Source: ordered a 2017 Chrysler Pacifica. Couldn't order 15" wheels with premium trim. Ordered a spare tire, and got the built-in vacuum instead (this worked out OK, the donut spare, ordered separately, fits under in the middle seat stowage, if you finagle it). Still would have prefered 15" wheels over 17" or whatever we had to order, but not enough to buy new wheels. Would not recommend buying that early in the model cycle, but that's somewhat separate from ordering; except that they had no Pacificas on the lot to sell anyway, so it wasn't too hard to convince them to order one.
  - rconti 6y ago
    Yeah, that's a good example. My Golf R only had 2 option packages to choose from. Can't get a sunroof. Can't get a spare tire, even though it fits. (order the parts at retail from Europe at a HUGE retail markup, install them yourself). Something like 5 color choices. No wheel options. Can't get the great cloth seats available in Europe.
    - shuckles 6y ago
      It seems like this thread is missing the history of mass car manufacturing entirely, which began with a single SKU for the Model T. Customization to your heart’s content was never the strength. Especially for non-luxury brands. Try working through a Porsche configuration: you can select the color of the stitching!
      - fomine3 6y ago
        It's interesting that US car culture still affected from Model T. At least in Japan, any car (except commercial vehicle) is somewhat or very customizable for interior/exterior even in $10k.
- 93po 6y ago
  Heck, even just ordering a Macbook Air M1 with a terabyte SSD yesterday showed that it was going to take a month to get to me
jacobkg 6y ago
Same! What’s especially misleading is that most of the car manufacturer websites have a “Build your own” tool where you can select the features and options that you want, only to discover that no cars exist in that configuration.
- sprite 6y ago
  Just go to the dealer and spec the car like you want it, put a deposit down and wait a few months for it to arrive. If you want something bespoke you can't expect it to be in inventory.
- niffydroid 6y ago
  I generally buy Nissan because the local dealer is good. Generally the base models have what people want, it's only fancy interior or exterior add-ons that make you wait. Base models have ac, sat nav, cameras etc already. Generally you don't have to wait too long because the car is already built or there is one to that spec being built soon. I think the most I had to wait was 2 months
- tpetry 6y ago
  I don‘t get the problem. In germany you go to a desler and tell them you want this specific configuration, you sign a contract and 3-4 months later your specific build is delivered to the dealery.
  - TheMog 6y ago
    Most car dealers in the US, at least for “normal” (ie, non-premium) car brands are extremely reluctant to custom order cars and often outright refuse to do so. They also tend to put subtle pressure on customers to buy something of the lot right now instead. The car buying experience is very different over here compared to Germany.

0goel0 6y ago

A part of that could be that no one wants to accept they paid a lot for a broken product. It hurts the ego.

rainyMammoth 6y ago

For some reason this type of behavior is very specific to Tesla. There is something to be said about feeling as part of a community (or as some would say, a cult).

cavisne 6y ago

There is simply no car that compares if you like tech. And there is no other practical (ie road trips) EV in the US. These stories tend to be outliers, most people don’t know what a panel gap is and would never think to measure the ground clearance.

miked85 6y ago
> most people don’t know what a panel gap is and would never think to measure the ground clearance. That doesn't excuse poor engineering. You also might measure ground clearance if you can't park your car: " His car has a 12 cm (4.7 in) ground clearance, which will not allow him to enter his parking spot – hence his concern about it. "
foepys 6y ago
What exactly does make Tesla a tech company compared to other car manufacturers? Nearly all car manufacturers have adaptive cruise control somewhere in their lineup - they just don't claim to reach FSD with the currently used hardware. But almost all are actively researching FSD with different hardware. Making EVs doesn't make you a tech company. ICE are even more complicated than electric engines and Tesla doesn't make their batteries themselves. I'm getting strong WeWork vibes from Tesla's claim to be a tech company.
- abc_lisper 6y ago
  I have test driven a few cars before ending up with a model 3. Autopilot really takes the edge off and handles the car with confidence . No other car came close then, and was the only car then providing software updates which would make it even better. Tesla is no wework ..
  - tempestn 6y ago
    I have trouble understanding how autopilot could be relaxing. You have to be constantly vigilant lest it drive you into a concrete barrier or parked truck—yes those events are highly unlikely, but that would just make it more difficult to stay focused. And if I have to be entirely focused on the road anyway, why not just guide the car myself?

alacombe 6y ago

Look at Apple fanboys, screwed over years after years, but still waiting in lines to buy the new iShit.

14 6y ago

Yes his attitude baffled me as well. I won’t buy Dodge products because as a back yard mechanic they are the vehicle that has let me down the most. They have ghost issues that are near impossible to track down and fix. Transmission issues. Electrical issues. I could rant all day. I finally saved up and went with a Toyota and now feel comfortable driving long distances again and know I should be good for several hundred thousand miles. I honestly believe Tesla is playing with fire with this poor quality control. They may get away with it for now but I promise as they grow if they don’t address these issues you will have the opposite of a fan club and people who hate your product and promote others to their friends. I have convinced several people not to buy dodge/Chrysler. They are cheap to but cheaply made as well and guaranteed to let you down. Will Tesla become the next Dodge?

sbierwagen 6y ago

It's in the very next paragraph? >“In Hong Kong, any new car demands a 100 percent tax. Electric cars had no tax, so I bought the Model S and the Model X. Now we have to pay a 25-percent tax on EVs, which is still lower than with regular combustion-engined vehicles, but what will happen to the company when these incentives are over? Will people still want to buy cars that seem to come from a junkyard?” He's not complaining about the service, because the car is half the price of any other car. It's like complaining that a Chevrolet Aveo is small and the engine is underpowered.

thatguy0900 6y ago
"As for the Model 3 he was not able to refuse, Chan said he paid for the EV but cannot use it. The Hong Kong Service Center said he would have to wait until mid-February to pick up his car. Only by then they would be able to fix some of the issues he spotted. His Model X is also at the Service Center, which left him pretty much on foot." he doesn't even have what he paid for though