4 ms·

Because it would make China liable, and for the majority of individuals, their stance on China as a good actor in global matters is now linked to their American

Because it would make China liable, and for the majority of individuals, their stance on China as a good actor in global matters is now linked to their American political allegiance. It is hard for many folks to reconcile both.

deeviant 6y ago
How does it make China more liable. Allowing wet markets to exist is a equal or greater threat than shoddy research labs.
- amanaplanacanal 6y ago
  Are you suggesting that people should not be able to hunt for wild foods? Or that they shouldn’t be able to sell what they catch or kill? Or something else?
  - SpaceRaccoon 6y ago
    If it's proven that wet markets are a breeding ground for novel viruses, then yeah, clearly they should be banned.
    - thelittleone 6y ago
      Banned by who? Looking at the relative impact of the virus it seems the US is harder hit. Although the virus appears to be a tragic accident, a weakened US allows other nations to make advances. That being said, I tend to agree with your assertion.
      - SpaceRaccoon 6y ago
        Surely the rest of the world has the leverage to pressure China to ban wild-animal markets.
        dathinab 6y ago
        There are similar markets in the rest of the word so, no. There is also no need to ban such markets, but to further regulate what and how things can be sold is reasonable. One problem often ignored is that because of differences in general wealth it's e.g. not always/every where feasible to require selling only pre-processed (cut apart) meat (and other body parts) as the necessary fridge infrastructure doesn't exist and would be to expansive.
    - iso1210 6y ago
      SARS was proven to come from wetmarkets back in 2003. They were banned by China, then unbanned later.
      - freddie_mercury 6y ago
        China has never banned wet markets. A wet market is just a place that sells fresh meat or vegetables. The butcher who supplies your favorite restaurant is a wet market. The fruit & veg stand where you buy organic heirloom tomatoes is a wet market. Every farmer's market is a wet market. "Wet market" just distinguishes from "dry market" where durable goods like electronics are sold. China never banned wet markets, which makes about as much sense as saying someone has "banned supermarkets". They banned the sale of certain items at wet markets. (I live in Asia and shop at a wet market multiple times a week.)
        someperson 6y ago
        People use wet market synonymously with 'exotic wildlife market' that sell living caged animals in outdoor unsanitary conditions. Often cages stacked on top of each other. Factory farming of eg, chickens and pigs has previously led to avian and swine flu outbreaks, so there's strict monitoring of viruses around those farm monocultures. But in the wet markets of Asia there's often multiple species together that would rarely encounter each other in the wild. Traditional Chinese Medicine uses bat feces, pangolin scales and other exotic products, with an emphasis on live animals. Bats and pangolins are a vector for virus and cross-species virus transmission. Moving wet markets indoors into sanitary conditions, and banning the sale of live produce would go a long way to preventing future outbreaks.
        selimthegrim 6y ago
        Probably just means market not for dry goods
        freddie_mercury 6y ago
        Some people might use it that way. No one who lives in Asia around wet markets uses it that way. Regardless, it doesn't change my point that China never banned wet markets, not even for one day.
mschuster91 6y ago
For what it's worth China is seen as a threat by many people in Western countries irrespective of political allegiance... the nationalist/right wing doesn't like Chinese price dumping and espionage, the left wing is pissed about China's atrocious human rights and environmental track record.
nmlnn 6y ago
Not really, the Wuhan lab received funding for the studies into gain of function for bat coronaviruses from the NIH (via EcoHealth Alliance). The incentive to bury the origin (if this was the origin) would be high for the US and China both.
- mikhailfranco 6y ago
  ...and Ralph Baric (UNC) and Peter Daszak (EcoHealth Alliance) both: Will we ever learn the truth about China and the pandemic? Two inquiries are 'cloaked in secrecy' WHO lets Beijing vet investigators and it appoints British scientist with links to Wuhan https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9071191/Will-learn-truth-China-pandemic-writes-IAN-BIRRELL.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9071191/Will-learn-...

deeviant 6y ago

How does it make China more liable. Allowing wet markets to exist is a equal or greater threat than shoddy research labs.

amanaplanacanal 6y ago
Are you suggesting that people should not be able to hunt for wild foods? Or that they shouldn’t be able to sell what they catch or kill? Or something else?
- SpaceRaccoon 6y ago
  If it's proven that wet markets are a breeding ground for novel viruses, then yeah, clearly they should be banned.
  - thelittleone 6y ago
    Banned by who? Looking at the relative impact of the virus it seems the US is harder hit. Although the virus appears to be a tragic accident, a weakened US allows other nations to make advances. That being said, I tend to agree with your assertion.
    - SpaceRaccoon 6y ago
      Surely the rest of the world has the leverage to pressure China to ban wild-animal markets.
      - dathinab 6y ago
        There are similar markets in the rest of the word so, no. There is also no need to ban such markets, but to further regulate what and how things can be sold is reasonable. One problem often ignored is that because of differences in general wealth it's e.g. not always/every where feasible to require selling only pre-processed (cut apart) meat (and other body parts) as the necessary fridge infrastructure doesn't exist and would be to expansive.
  - iso1210 6y ago
    SARS was proven to come from wetmarkets back in 2003. They were banned by China, then unbanned later.
    - freddie_mercury 6y ago
      China has never banned wet markets. A wet market is just a place that sells fresh meat or vegetables. The butcher who supplies your favorite restaurant is a wet market. The fruit & veg stand where you buy organic heirloom tomatoes is a wet market. Every farmer's market is a wet market. "Wet market" just distinguishes from "dry market" where durable goods like electronics are sold. China never banned wet markets, which makes about as much sense as saying someone has "banned supermarkets". They banned the sale of certain items at wet markets. (I live in Asia and shop at a wet market multiple times a week.)
      - someperson 6y ago
        People use wet market synonymously with 'exotic wildlife market' that sell living caged animals in outdoor unsanitary conditions. Often cages stacked on top of each other. Factory farming of eg, chickens and pigs has previously led to avian and swine flu outbreaks, so there's strict monitoring of viruses around those farm monocultures. But in the wet markets of Asia there's often multiple species together that would rarely encounter each other in the wild. Traditional Chinese Medicine uses bat feces, pangolin scales and other exotic products, with an emphasis on live animals. Bats and pangolins are a vector for virus and cross-species virus transmission. Moving wet markets indoors into sanitary conditions, and banning the sale of live produce would go a long way to preventing future outbreaks.
        selimthegrim 6y ago
        Probably just means market not for dry goods
        freddie_mercury 6y ago
        Some people might use it that way. No one who lives in Asia around wet markets uses it that way. Regardless, it doesn't change my point that China never banned wet markets, not even for one day.

mschuster91 6y ago

For what it's worth China is seen as a threat by many people in Western countries irrespective of political allegiance... the nationalist/right wing doesn't like Chinese price dumping and espionage, the left wing is pissed about China's atrocious human rights and environmental track record.

nmlnn 6y ago

Not really, the Wuhan lab received funding for the studies into gain of function for bat coronaviruses from the NIH (via EcoHealth Alliance). The incentive to bury the origin (if this was the origin) would be high for the US and China both.

mikhailfranco 6y ago
...and Ralph Baric (UNC) and Peter Daszak (EcoHealth Alliance) both: Will we ever learn the truth about China and the pandemic? Two inquiries are 'cloaked in secrecy' WHO lets Beijing vet investigators and it appoints British scientist with links to Wuhan https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9071191/Will-learn-truth-China-pandemic-writes-IAN-BIRRELL.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9071191/Will-learn-...