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This article sort of half-made sense until I read this part: "But corporations all depend on the state and their workers to survive, and thus there are ways to

by oliv__ 6y ago

This article sort of half-made sense until I read this part: "But corporations all depend on the state and their workers to survive, and thus there are ways to seize it, democratize it, and keep it in public hands where it belongs" MMhh.. excuse me? Says who? Stalin? Lately there seems to be a strong, veiled and (dare I say) coordinated effort to put down capitalism in the US. Has everyone forgotten what built this great country in the first place?

antisthenes 6y ago
> Lately there seems to be a strong, veiled and (dare I say) coordinated effort to put down capitalism in the US. Has everyone forgotten what built this great country in the first place? Sure. In rough historic order: Slavery, genocide of the natives and theft of their land, unprecedented consumption of fossil based fuels, invention of consumerism as a culture, untouched industrial capacity after WWII and massive brain drain from developing countries. Which ones were you referring to exactly?
- fr11 6y ago
  Those are definitely things that helped build this country, but one of them - massive brain drain from developing countries - (and by the way, you missed from Soviet countries) - is based on the fact that there's something appealing about living here. Some folks like to call that freedom, or a set of ideals about how we structure things. I agree with the parent comment that lately people are really down on the US and capitalism, and others are super positive about it in unthinking response. Capitalism has provided a lot of amazing things - avocados are always available! - but also done damage and been destructive. Similarly, America was the experiment and inspiration for modern democratic/republican governance, and a major component in the beginning of more freedom for more people, while also having been built on slavery, the killing of natives, massive environmental devastation, and other terrible things. The world is really complex, and simplifying things to good or evil tends to lose a lot of reality.

by oliv__ 6y ago

antisthenes 6y ago

> Lately there seems to be a strong, veiled and (dare I say) coordinated effort to put down capitalism in the US. Has everyone forgotten what built this great country in the first place? Sure. In rough historic order: Slavery, genocide of the natives and theft of their land, unprecedented consumption of fossil based fuels, invention of consumerism as a culture, untouched industrial capacity after WWII and massive brain drain from developing countries. Which ones were you referring to exactly?

fr11 6y ago
Those are definitely things that helped build this country, but one of them - massive brain drain from developing countries - (and by the way, you missed from Soviet countries) - is based on the fact that there's something appealing about living here. Some folks like to call that freedom, or a set of ideals about how we structure things. I agree with the parent comment that lately people are really down on the US and capitalism, and others are super positive about it in unthinking response. Capitalism has provided a lot of amazing things - avocados are always available! - but also done damage and been destructive. Similarly, America was the experiment and inspiration for modern democratic/republican governance, and a major component in the beginning of more freedom for more people, while also having been built on slavery, the killing of natives, massive environmental devastation, and other terrible things. The world is really complex, and simplifying things to good or evil tends to lose a lot of reality.