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nah. I think Balmer did wonders for Ms. It’s really easy to blame the guy but I think it’s important to look at the context (of when he took over, what he actua

nah. I think Balmer did wonders for Ms. It’s really easy to blame the guy but I think it’s important to look at the context (of when he took over, what he actually did) also, he is the only CEO I routinely saw at the “corporate gym” in Redmond before the pandemic struck. No bodyguards, no nothings. Like a regular dude going to the gym, hanging out in the sauna/jacuzzi. He had a super positive attitude towards the staff and other people that would strike up a conversation. While I did not the to have the image of a naked Ballmer burned into my retinas, I do appreciate that he did not let all that wealth go to his head.

nailer 6y ago
When he started Microsoft had the most popular OS, web browser and mobile OS. A decade later they lost all three and their market cap barely moved.
- HenryKissinger 6y ago
  Windows remains the most popular operating system for computers by far, and that will never change.
  - TylerE 6y ago
    I suppose that depends on how all gazillion AWS instances running Linux counts.
    - rantwasp 6y ago
      AWS instances run Windows too. And MS makes money off those instances. Also, Azure runs Linux too. Microsoft is in the post-Windows phase and it's working on things that will keep it relevant long term
      - NewLogic 6y ago
        Agreed, they have even begun making good hardware outside of gaming. The surface range is hugely popular in the corporate scene.
    - pjmlp 6y ago
      On top of Hyper-V actually.
  - _-___________-_ 6y ago
    Only if you play some jedi mind tricks of your own with the definition of a "computer".
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 6y ago
      You don't need to change the statement much to make it unequivocally true: just change "computers" to "desktop computers".
      - _-___________-_ 6y ago
        Which are nowhere near the most common type of computer, so it's a fairly significant change.
        tester34 6y ago
        honestly what kind of gymnatics we have to do in order to just accept the fact that windows is most popular os on desktop/home/work(non-server) PCs?
        nailer 6y ago
        Yes and zOS is the most popular OS for mainframes.
        _-___________-_ 6y ago
        Sure, if "computer" to you means "laptop or desktop PC". My smartphone is a computer, which I use at home and work, and it sure as hell doesn't run Windows. Smartphones are a far more significant type of computer in the modern world than laptop or desktop PCs.
- donatj 6y ago
  I'm pretty sure Windows at no point lost its thrive as most popular non-mobile OS
  - edgyquant 6y ago
    Sure but the market moved to mobile. If you cherry pick data of course you can pretend to be right.
    - unnouinceput 6y ago
      The market did not moved to mobile. Mobile is alongside desktop. People like diversity and mobile offered another one. And people who have only mobile in their homes are poor that can't afford desktop but I see mobile as a gateway drug to desktop. Once people will have enough money, will also buy desktop exactly because mobile hooked them in the first place.
      - macintux 6y ago
        The numbers to this point disagree, and I don't think you'll find a lot of support for your prediction of a change in direction. https://www.broadbandsearch.net/blog/mobile-desktop-internet-usage-statistics https://www.broadbandsearch.net/blog/mobile-desktop-internet...
        nitrogen 6y ago
        You can't really use percentages to say that something has declined if the whole pie is growing, and web use is maybe the one thing that looks least favorable for desktops.
        macintux 6y ago
        Ok, here are absolute numbers. PC sales look stagnant at best. https://www.statista.com/statistics/263393/global-pc-shipments-since-1st-quarter-2009-by-vendor/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/263393/global-pc-shipmen...
- rantwasp 6y ago
  one could argue that Windows is the most popular consumer OS even today (keep in mind the HN is not representative for what people normally run). Also, a decade later, Microsoft is experiencing a software renaissance, in part, due to the the work Ballmer setup. One example: Azure. In the cloud space there are 2 gorillas: AWS and Azure (everything else is vaporware and at this point I don't think it would be wise to bet the farm on GCP or ... Oracle). How did Azure get here? Do you think they decided to do cloud and it happened magically? Another example: the XBOX. I personally will never but a PS, and I believe XBOX is awesome in this space.
  - nailer 6y ago
    The most popular consumer OS is Android. Arguing anything else goes against all known stats. Microsoft's renaissance is mainly due to Nadella focusing on software and services instead of selling Windows. You mentioned Xbox as a way to support Ballmer. The Xbox story mentioned in the article does not support Ballmer. Agreed re Azure but I don't know if Ballmer was still focusing on Windows for Azure, which seems likely. Keep in mind Azure is mostly Linux instances today.
    - pjmlp 6y ago
      Try to do Office documents for school work on Android.
      - thekyle 6y ago
        Office has a native version for Android with apparently over a hundred million downloads. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.microsoft.office.officehubrow https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.microsoft....
        rantwasp 6y ago
        huh? ms making money on android. shocker
        pjmlp 6y ago
- 3pt14159 6y ago
  I'm sorry, but their market cap is like 10x in the past decade. Their revenue streams are different now, yes, but they recognized they'd lost the platform with the SaaSification of most things and they wisely moved into other areas. Yes, they could have tried something else that kept them as the winners of the OS game, but vertical integration wasn't really in their bloodstream. Platforming and services were.
  - nailer 6y ago
    >> A decade later (when Ballmer finished) they lost all three and their market cap barely moved. > their market cap is like 10x in the past decade Steve Ballmer left 6 years ago. Pick your source regarding Microsoft's market cap while Ballmer was leading: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=steve+ballmer+market+cap https://duckduckgo.com/?q=steve+ballmer+market+cap https://duckduckgo.com/?q=microsoft+lost+decade https://duckduckgo.com/?q=microsoft+lost+decade
    - 3pt14159 6y ago
      Oh, I'm wrong then. I was under the mistaken impression that he was CEO much more recently than that. Thanks for the correction, it appears that you're completely correct about his leadership. Thanks for updating my view!
bobobob420 6y ago
He botched Microsoft pretty bad.. windows 8 was his hallmark project no? And the beginning of surface was not that good. Once Satya took over Microsoft became a powerhouse again with their cloud/office integration + focus on azure.
- phkahler 6y ago
  Computers have been going back and forth between desktop and central servers for 40 years. When people tire of the cloud and shift back to local control, microsoft will no longer have an advantage over alternatives.
  - belltaco 6y ago
    That makes no sense. You seem to be confusing Windows with ChromeOS.
  - rytill 6y ago
    I can’t tell if this is a manufactured pattern, or if it’s true and I’m missing something because I haven’t been alive long enough. From what I can tell, once upon a time we had mainframes and server rooms and big expensive computers, and there was no personal computing. Then, we got personal computing and had very limited consumer connection to centralized servers on them. A lot of people barely had internet. Then, we connected personal computing to centralized servers and many products were born. Now, we have platforms built for creating centralized services because managing your own hardware was not necessary. Where is the pattern there? It seems like you’re extrapolating a wave pattern from what could be a single datapoint. We got this, we got that, we connected them, now we’re here. Where is the back-and-forth you implied?
    - phkahler 6y ago
      After desktops came along like the Apple II and DOS based PCs, people had full control. Then we got networking to share printers, and IT started controlling things again. It's been a constant back and forth ever since. Not all the way to the extremes, and not every company at the same time. Not everyone ran Novell Netware for example.
mi_lk 6y ago
Do you want to expand?
- rantwasp 6y ago
  when Ballmer took over MS was right after the anti-trust fiasco. There was a time when people were not sure if the software giant was going to survive. They did under Ballmer. From a sales pov, the company also grew and prospered. Microsoft had phenomenal growth while under Ballmer. It's easy to remember all the things he botched (hello iphone?) but if you look at it objectively I think Ms did survive and prospered under Ballmer.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - Judgmentality 6y ago
    > It's easy to remember all the things he botched (hello iphone?) but if you look at it objectively I think Ms did survive and prospered under Ballmer. If you look at it objectively you include all the things he botched, which are "easy to remember" according to you. At best, he was meh. In my personal opinion he was horrible - I think a random employee likely would have done better.
    - rantwasp 6y ago
      I’m going to respectfully disagree. He did contribute to MS before he became CEO. And invested in a lot of things where the fruits are harvested to this day.
      - MichaelZuo 6y ago
        When cycles happen on decade long time scales and planning horizons outlast a ceo’s tenure assessing credit and blame becomes exponentially harder. Your right on with Balmer’s contributions. One wonders how the future of civilization will work if the vast majority cannot even understand the true scope of the wheels they’re standing on, or turning in the background.

nailer 6y ago

When he started Microsoft had the most popular OS, web browser and mobile OS. A decade later they lost all three and their market cap barely moved.

HenryKissinger 6y ago
Windows remains the most popular operating system for computers by far, and that will never change.
- TylerE 6y ago
  I suppose that depends on how all gazillion AWS instances running Linux counts.
  - rantwasp 6y ago
    AWS instances run Windows too. And MS makes money off those instances. Also, Azure runs Linux too. Microsoft is in the post-Windows phase and it's working on things that will keep it relevant long term
    - NewLogic 6y ago
      Agreed, they have even begun making good hardware outside of gaming. The surface range is hugely popular in the corporate scene.
  - pjmlp 6y ago
    On top of Hyper-V actually.
- _-___________-_ 6y ago
  Only if you play some jedi mind tricks of your own with the definition of a "computer".
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 6y ago
    You don't need to change the statement much to make it unequivocally true: just change "computers" to "desktop computers".
    - _-___________-_ 6y ago
      Which are nowhere near the most common type of computer, so it's a fairly significant change.
      - tester34 6y ago
        honestly what kind of gymnatics we have to do in order to just accept the fact that windows is most popular os on desktop/home/work(non-server) PCs?
        nailer 6y ago
        Yes and zOS is the most popular OS for mainframes.
        _-___________-_ 6y ago
        Sure, if "computer" to you means "laptop or desktop PC". My smartphone is a computer, which I use at home and work, and it sure as hell doesn't run Windows. Smartphones are a far more significant type of computer in the modern world than laptop or desktop PCs.
donatj 6y ago
I'm pretty sure Windows at no point lost its thrive as most popular non-mobile OS
- edgyquant 6y ago
  Sure but the market moved to mobile. If you cherry pick data of course you can pretend to be right.
  - unnouinceput 6y ago
    The market did not moved to mobile. Mobile is alongside desktop. People like diversity and mobile offered another one. And people who have only mobile in their homes are poor that can't afford desktop but I see mobile as a gateway drug to desktop. Once people will have enough money, will also buy desktop exactly because mobile hooked them in the first place.
    - macintux 6y ago
      The numbers to this point disagree, and I don't think you'll find a lot of support for your prediction of a change in direction. https://www.broadbandsearch.net/blog/mobile-desktop-internet-usage-statistics https://www.broadbandsearch.net/blog/mobile-desktop-internet...
      - nitrogen 6y ago
        You can't really use percentages to say that something has declined if the whole pie is growing, and web use is maybe the one thing that looks least favorable for desktops.
        macintux 6y ago
        Ok, here are absolute numbers. PC sales look stagnant at best. https://www.statista.com/statistics/263393/global-pc-shipments-since-1st-quarter-2009-by-vendor/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/263393/global-pc-shipmen...
rantwasp 6y ago
one could argue that Windows is the most popular consumer OS even today (keep in mind the HN is not representative for what people normally run). Also, a decade later, Microsoft is experiencing a software renaissance, in part, due to the the work Ballmer setup. One example: Azure. In the cloud space there are 2 gorillas: AWS and Azure (everything else is vaporware and at this point I don't think it would be wise to bet the farm on GCP or ... Oracle). How did Azure get here? Do you think they decided to do cloud and it happened magically? Another example: the XBOX. I personally will never but a PS, and I believe XBOX is awesome in this space.
- nailer 6y ago
  The most popular consumer OS is Android. Arguing anything else goes against all known stats. Microsoft's renaissance is mainly due to Nadella focusing on software and services instead of selling Windows. You mentioned Xbox as a way to support Ballmer. The Xbox story mentioned in the article does not support Ballmer. Agreed re Azure but I don't know if Ballmer was still focusing on Windows for Azure, which seems likely. Keep in mind Azure is mostly Linux instances today.
  - pjmlp 6y ago
    Try to do Office documents for school work on Android.
    - thekyle 6y ago
      Office has a native version for Android with apparently over a hundred million downloads. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.microsoft.office.officehubrow https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.microsoft....
      - rantwasp 6y ago
        huh? ms making money on android. shocker
      - pjmlp 6y ago
3pt14159 6y ago
I'm sorry, but their market cap is like 10x in the past decade. Their revenue streams are different now, yes, but they recognized they'd lost the platform with the SaaSification of most things and they wisely moved into other areas. Yes, they could have tried something else that kept them as the winners of the OS game, but vertical integration wasn't really in their bloodstream. Platforming and services were.
- nailer 6y ago
  >> A decade later (when Ballmer finished) they lost all three and their market cap barely moved. > their market cap is like 10x in the past decade Steve Ballmer left 6 years ago. Pick your source regarding Microsoft's market cap while Ballmer was leading: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=steve+ballmer+market+cap https://duckduckgo.com/?q=steve+ballmer+market+cap https://duckduckgo.com/?q=microsoft+lost+decade https://duckduckgo.com/?q=microsoft+lost+decade
  - 3pt14159 6y ago
    Oh, I'm wrong then. I was under the mistaken impression that he was CEO much more recently than that. Thanks for the correction, it appears that you're completely correct about his leadership. Thanks for updating my view!

bobobob420 6y ago

He botched Microsoft pretty bad.. windows 8 was his hallmark project no? And the beginning of surface was not that good. Once Satya took over Microsoft became a powerhouse again with their cloud/office integration + focus on azure.

phkahler 6y ago
Computers have been going back and forth between desktop and central servers for 40 years. When people tire of the cloud and shift back to local control, microsoft will no longer have an advantage over alternatives.
- belltaco 6y ago
  That makes no sense. You seem to be confusing Windows with ChromeOS.
- rytill 6y ago
  I can’t tell if this is a manufactured pattern, or if it’s true and I’m missing something because I haven’t been alive long enough. From what I can tell, once upon a time we had mainframes and server rooms and big expensive computers, and there was no personal computing. Then, we got personal computing and had very limited consumer connection to centralized servers on them. A lot of people barely had internet. Then, we connected personal computing to centralized servers and many products were born. Now, we have platforms built for creating centralized services because managing your own hardware was not necessary. Where is the pattern there? It seems like you’re extrapolating a wave pattern from what could be a single datapoint. We got this, we got that, we connected them, now we’re here. Where is the back-and-forth you implied?
  - phkahler 6y ago
    After desktops came along like the Apple II and DOS based PCs, people had full control. Then we got networking to share printers, and IT started controlling things again. It's been a constant back and forth ever since. Not all the way to the extremes, and not every company at the same time. Not everyone ran Novell Netware for example.

mi_lk 6y ago

Do you want to expand?

rantwasp 6y ago
when Ballmer took over MS was right after the anti-trust fiasco. There was a time when people were not sure if the software giant was going to survive. They did under Ballmer. From a sales pov, the company also grew and prospered. Microsoft had phenomenal growth while under Ballmer. It's easy to remember all the things he botched (hello iphone?) but if you look at it objectively I think Ms did survive and prospered under Ballmer.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- Judgmentality 6y ago
  > It's easy to remember all the things he botched (hello iphone?) but if you look at it objectively I think Ms did survive and prospered under Ballmer. If you look at it objectively you include all the things he botched, which are "easy to remember" according to you. At best, he was meh. In my personal opinion he was horrible - I think a random employee likely would have done better.
  - rantwasp 6y ago
    I’m going to respectfully disagree. He did contribute to MS before he became CEO. And invested in a lot of things where the fruits are harvested to this day.
    - MichaelZuo 6y ago
      When cycles happen on decade long time scales and planning horizons outlast a ceo’s tenure assessing credit and blame becomes exponentially harder. Your right on with Balmer’s contributions. One wonders how the future of civilization will work if the vast majority cannot even understand the true scope of the wheels they’re standing on, or turning in the background.