4 ms·

I agree with all these points, but I think one point not being made is alot of pay in the trades is alot higher than some people think(in higher paying metro ar

I agree with all these points, but I think one point not being made is alot of pay in the trades is alot higher than some people think(in higher paying metro areas). Alot of people in my Wife's family are either electricians, or building engineers/heavy machine owner/operators. And they all are doing fine. Here are some examples of rough pay(all are unions jobs and dues are due): - Owner/operator of heavy construction equipment typically makes $175 an hour or more(maintenance costs are high and work dispatch takes a cut also) yearly salary was usually ~ $150k - Electricians make between $47-55 an hour, this does not include overtime as my Wife's cousin made 40-50% more due to OT. - Building engineers pay varies, but a good amount pay $80-90k+. All salaries are SF bay area, almost everyone mentioned owns their own home. Ages range from low 60's to early 40's. One important point that differs from the Simpsons is that every person mentioned(all are married) the spouse works and also makes a similar salary(no one has more than 2 kids also). So a Simpsons existence is very hard to emulate, but the "trades" pay more than alot of people expect.

01100011 6y ago
> almost everyone mentioned owns their own home. Ages range from low 60's to early 40's You don't think these two facts are related? What about 20-something tradesmen? Will they ever be able to afford their own home?
- subsubzero 6y ago
  All I know is all the people mentioned do not live lavishly, they do not go on expensive vacations, they do not drive Tesla/BMW/Mercedes, eat out constantly, or dress expensively. So having another spouse working and being in the trades I think its very doable as long as you pick your house/condo in the right place, ie. Hayward/east bay, Santa Cruz Mountains, Daly City/South San Francisco. Also saving up for a downpayment for a few years is needed.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  >You don't think these two facts are related? What about 20-something tradesmen? The 20-something tradesmen have mostly not settled down that much yet just like the 20-something software engineers so they live in apartments wherever. The biggest difference now compared to the 90s is that the blue collar people have been pushed 20-40min farther out of the major cities. Homer Simpson probably commuted 30min. Now the white collar engineer commutes 30min and the electrician commutes 30min farther because that's where the suburb he can afford is. The white collar engineer lives in what used to be the blue collar suburb. Also in my anecdotal experience it seems like stay at home mothers haven't totally gone away with either group but they've become rarer in the white collar group than the blue collar group. Everyone blue collar I know bought their first house at 30+/- a few. The people that bought sooner were the people who prioritized it because they were popping out a lot of kids or were beginning to build their own business and needed space. If anything it seems like the blue collar crowd buys a little before the white collar crowd simply because they're more open to living farther out in order to make things affordable. >Will they ever be able to afford their own home? Yes. It just won't be in the same suburb as the people on HN.

01100011 6y ago

> almost everyone mentioned owns their own home. Ages range from low 60's to early 40's You don't think these two facts are related? What about 20-something tradesmen? Will they ever be able to afford their own home?

subsubzero 6y ago
All I know is all the people mentioned do not live lavishly, they do not go on expensive vacations, they do not drive Tesla/BMW/Mercedes, eat out constantly, or dress expensively. So having another spouse working and being in the trades I think its very doable as long as you pick your house/condo in the right place, ie. Hayward/east bay, Santa Cruz Mountains, Daly City/South San Francisco. Also saving up for a downpayment for a few years is needed.
throwaway0a5e 6y ago
>You don't think these two facts are related? What about 20-something tradesmen? The 20-something tradesmen have mostly not settled down that much yet just like the 20-something software engineers so they live in apartments wherever. The biggest difference now compared to the 90s is that the blue collar people have been pushed 20-40min farther out of the major cities. Homer Simpson probably commuted 30min. Now the white collar engineer commutes 30min and the electrician commutes 30min farther because that's where the suburb he can afford is. The white collar engineer lives in what used to be the blue collar suburb. Also in my anecdotal experience it seems like stay at home mothers haven't totally gone away with either group but they've become rarer in the white collar group than the blue collar group. Everyone blue collar I know bought their first house at 30+/- a few. The people that bought sooner were the people who prioritized it because they were popping out a lot of kids or were beginning to build their own business and needed space. If anything it seems like the blue collar crowd buys a little before the white collar crowd simply because they're more open to living farther out in order to make things affordable. >Will they ever be able to afford their own home? Yes. It just won't be in the same suburb as the people on HN.