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A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. This is not home market, it's professional market or hoarding (by today's standards). Objections o

A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. This is not home market, it's professional market or hoarding (by today's standards). Objections on the failure rate of HDDs are absolutely valid, but then one should also need to consider the bigger picture (e.g. storage loss), in which case, having a remote copy is also important.

segfaultbuserr 6y ago
> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. [...] hoarding (by today's standards). You have an interesting argument - by the same reasoning, when one has eventually filled up a 12 TB HDD, it would no longer be hoarding by tomorrow's standard. In other words, at this point, one should be able to get the next generation of HDDs for cheap, and it's this fact that makes all tape drives unnecessary. Now I wonder whether it was a mistake for me to buy a spare 14 TB HDD to 1:1 mirror my new file server for cold backup. Perhaps a smaller one should be good for 5 years anyway...
throwaway201103 6y ago
> 12 TB HDD ... This is not home market, Indeed. The home directory on my PC at home has 80GB of files stored. Most of it is just there out of laziness. About the only thing I try to keep backups of are my tax returns. What do people have on a home machine that needs enterprise-grade backups? You might say photos and videos. I guess that's a personal thing; I realized a long time ago that I never spent any time actually looking at any of the pictures I took, so I stopped taking them.
- UMetaGOMS 6y ago
  100% agree. I have a NAS for photos and media, plus a big USB HDD for ZFS snapshots of my machines - but all of this is homelab tinkering, not an actual backup strategy. I realized in the last year or so that the only digital media I have which I would be genuinely sad to lose were wedding photos - so I saved those to 3 different cloud providers, made a Blu-ray copy, and a copy on the NAS. If I lose all of that in some tragedy, chances are I've got bigger things to worry about.
- tomcam 6y ago
  > I realized a long time ago that I never spent any time actually looking at any of the pictures I took, so I stopped taking them. That is a completely logical take. However, I sort of think of it as a posterity move. Although my kids might not particularly want to see pictures of themselves, their great grand children—or beyond—might love it. I would pay a pretty penny to see home movies of my grandparents, whom I never knew.
- y04nn 6y ago
  Photos, videos, music, but also current laptop backups, servers/VMs backups, current and past phones backups and HDD images of past computers hard drives (to be done), digitized family videos and photos (also to be done). It adds up quite fast. And being able to have put everything on a tape every year with a label on it would give me some peace of mind, even more if I place 2 of them on different location.
rualca 6y ago
> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. This is not home market (...) You're basing your argument on extreme and unrepresentative assumptions. First of all, you do not need to fill a storage device to the brim to justify it's use. You can use the exact same rationale to claim no one needs 500GB HDs even though they are pretty much standard these days. Additionally, you falsely assume that your data storage needs start the very moment someone buys a drive, and up till then they have no data lying around. That's not the case at all. People buy high-density storage devices because they already have the data lying around, and they don't want to lose it. You're ignoring that people already have piles of CDRs/DVDs/Blu-ray disks lying around. Additionally, you are somehow assuming that people would buy storage devices for their density, ignoring their primary use case: long term data preservation.
tomcam 6y ago
> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled I cheerfully quantify just about everything in my life, yet somehow I missed that one. I am a little bit of a data hoarder, or maybe just a little paranoid. Seeing those numbers is actually quite helpful. Thank you. PS I get downvoted a lot for comments like this, so in case it sounds sarcastic or facetious, it is not. I mean it sincerely.
fomine3 6y ago
10Mbps (average bitrate) video fills 10GB on 2.2 hours. I don't think such usage is hoarding for today.

segfaultbuserr 6y ago

> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. [...] hoarding (by today's standards). You have an interesting argument - by the same reasoning, when one has eventually filled up a 12 TB HDD, it would no longer be hoarding by tomorrow's standard. In other words, at this point, one should be able to get the next generation of HDDs for cheap, and it's this fact that makes all tape drives unnecessary. Now I wonder whether it was a mistake for me to buy a spare 14 TB HDD to 1:1 mirror my new file server for cold backup. Perhaps a smaller one should be good for 5 years anyway...

throwaway201103 6y ago

> 12 TB HDD ... This is not home market, Indeed. The home directory on my PC at home has 80GB of files stored. Most of it is just there out of laziness. About the only thing I try to keep backups of are my tax returns. What do people have on a home machine that needs enterprise-grade backups? You might say photos and videos. I guess that's a personal thing; I realized a long time ago that I never spent any time actually looking at any of the pictures I took, so I stopped taking them.

UMetaGOMS 6y ago
100% agree. I have a NAS for photos and media, plus a big USB HDD for ZFS snapshots of my machines - but all of this is homelab tinkering, not an actual backup strategy. I realized in the last year or so that the only digital media I have which I would be genuinely sad to lose were wedding photos - so I saved those to 3 different cloud providers, made a Blu-ray copy, and a copy on the NAS. If I lose all of that in some tragedy, chances are I've got bigger things to worry about.
tomcam 6y ago
> I realized a long time ago that I never spent any time actually looking at any of the pictures I took, so I stopped taking them. That is a completely logical take. However, I sort of think of it as a posterity move. Although my kids might not particularly want to see pictures of themselves, their great grand children—or beyond—might love it. I would pay a pretty penny to see home movies of my grandparents, whom I never knew.
y04nn 6y ago
Photos, videos, music, but also current laptop backups, servers/VMs backups, current and past phones backups and HDD images of past computers hard drives (to be done), digitized family videos and photos (also to be done). It adds up quite fast. And being able to have put everything on a tape every year with a label on it would give me some peace of mind, even more if I place 2 of them on different location.

rualca 6y ago

> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled. This is not home market (...) You're basing your argument on extreme and unrepresentative assumptions. First of all, you do not need to fill a storage device to the brim to justify it's use. You can use the exact same rationale to claim no one needs 500GB HDs even though they are pretty much standard these days. Additionally, you falsely assume that your data storage needs start the very moment someone buys a drive, and up till then they have no data lying around. That's not the case at all. People buy high-density storage devices because they already have the data lying around, and they don't want to lose it. You're ignoring that people already have piles of CDRs/DVDs/Blu-ray disks lying around. Additionally, you are somehow assuming that people would buy storage devices for their density, ignoring their primary use case: long term data preservation.

tomcam 6y ago

> A 12 TB HDD requires 10 GB/day for three years to be filled I cheerfully quantify just about everything in my life, yet somehow I missed that one. I am a little bit of a data hoarder, or maybe just a little paranoid. Seeing those numbers is actually quite helpful. Thank you. PS I get downvoted a lot for comments like this, so in case it sounds sarcastic or facetious, it is not. I mean it sincerely.

fomine3 6y ago

10Mbps (average bitrate) video fills 10GB on 2.2 hours. I don't think such usage is hoarding for today.