24 ms·

Docker has a layer file system. Meaning if you do it right, that Chrome container will share the same 500 MB base image layer with the Gimp container, or whatev

by knowhy 6y ago

Docker has a layer file system. Meaning if you do it right, that Chrome container will share the same 500 MB base image layer with the Gimp container, or whatever, making it less bloated than it appears when looking only at the footprint of the first image. I'm not stating that I believe it is a good idea to run desktop apps in Docker containers. It is not a good idea. But it is also not true that if someone would do it, it would necessary lead to a bloated filesystem. Docker will use a lot of disk space when using multiple base images.

sverhagen 6y ago
I fully agree with the original premise (to run more stuff in Docker). But if I maintain two tools, both using Docker, let's say they're both built in Python, they'll both be in their own Git repository, and their build pipelines will come up with independent Docker images for whomever wants to use those tools, and it seems like frivolous maintenance, if not an anti-pattern, to make sure that these tools are always using the same base image. And yes, if bandwidth and disk space were constraint for me, I'd probably reconsider (even on the original premise), but they are not. By the way, while I think you should run more stuff in Docker, I also think it is still totally reasonable to have your "main language stuff" installed "normally" (not in Docker). If I'm a Java developer, I'm "happy" to deal with Java's dependency b.s. on my normal system. Meanwhile, if I ever have to touch Ruby, I do not want to deal with Ruby's dependency b.s. on my normal system (rather run that in Docker). And vice versa, as I'm sure.
- LucasLarson 6y ago
  > If I'm a Java developer, I'm "happy" Oh yes, it would make me "happy", too.
- Kwpolska 6y ago
  Both of your Python projects will likely have `python:latest` (or such) as their base image. Sure, they will diverge after that (with further layers for dependencies and your code), but at least the base system will be shared.
  - sverhagen 6y ago
    Even if they used python:latest (as if that is the only flavor), they're only "latest" when I do my build. So, now I have to coordinate builds and releases. Unlikely to happen, and, again, an anti-pattern.
- solarengineer 6y ago
  As a Ruby, Node or Python language user, you may want to try rbenv, nodenv or pyenv respectively.
  - pdimitar 6y ago
    Or the ASDF version manager that covers all of them, and much more.
dimitar 6y ago
That is if you are using one base base image. Most likely you will be using Alpine, Ubuntu, Debian, Centos, Red hat, Oracle Linux and who knows what else in different containers, unless of course you have the patience to repackage all then versions you need for your favorite base image.
foepys 6y ago
We all know that his doesn't work in practice. Somebody will "urgently" need another dependency and build a new base image with this dependency inside. Or a security patch comes out and half of the developers update while the rest doesn't. Do this 4 or 5 times and you'll have the exact same fragmentation.
michaelt 6y ago
> that Chrome container will share the same 500 MB base image layer with the Gimp container, or whatever Only if they’ve all chosen the same base image. And if application developers could all agree on a fixed base image with fixed versions of dependencies, that’d be a Linux distro and we wouldn’t need docker to begin with :)

by knowhy 6y ago

sverhagen 6y ago

I fully agree with the original premise (to run more stuff in Docker). But if I maintain two tools, both using Docker, let's say they're both built in Python, they'll both be in their own Git repository, and their build pipelines will come up with independent Docker images for whomever wants to use those tools, and it seems like frivolous maintenance, if not an anti-pattern, to make sure that these tools are always using the same base image. And yes, if bandwidth and disk space were constraint for me, I'd probably reconsider (even on the original premise), but they are not. By the way, while I think you should run more stuff in Docker, I also think it is still totally reasonable to have your "main language stuff" installed "normally" (not in Docker). If I'm a Java developer, I'm "happy" to deal with Java's dependency b.s. on my normal system. Meanwhile, if I ever have to touch Ruby, I do not want to deal with Ruby's dependency b.s. on my normal system (rather run that in Docker). And vice versa, as I'm sure.

LucasLarson 6y ago
> If I'm a Java developer, I'm "happy" Oh yes, it would make me "happy", too.
Kwpolska 6y ago
Both of your Python projects will likely have `python:latest` (or such) as their base image. Sure, they will diverge after that (with further layers for dependencies and your code), but at least the base system will be shared.
- sverhagen 6y ago
  Even if they used python:latest (as if that is the only flavor), they're only "latest" when I do my build. So, now I have to coordinate builds and releases. Unlikely to happen, and, again, an anti-pattern.
solarengineer 6y ago
As a Ruby, Node or Python language user, you may want to try rbenv, nodenv or pyenv respectively.
- pdimitar 6y ago
  Or the ASDF version manager that covers all of them, and much more.

dimitar 6y ago

That is if you are using one base base image. Most likely you will be using Alpine, Ubuntu, Debian, Centos, Red hat, Oracle Linux and who knows what else in different containers, unless of course you have the patience to repackage all then versions you need for your favorite base image.

foepys 6y ago

We all know that his doesn't work in practice. Somebody will "urgently" need another dependency and build a new base image with this dependency inside. Or a security patch comes out and half of the developers update while the rest doesn't. Do this 4 or 5 times and you'll have the exact same fragmentation.

michaelt 6y ago

> that Chrome container will share the same 500 MB base image layer with the Gimp container, or whatever Only if they’ve all chosen the same base image. And if application developers could all agree on a fixed base image with fixed versions of dependencies, that’d be a Linux distro and we wouldn’t need docker to begin with :)