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Storing keystrokes used to make a document reminds of a comparison between personal data and toxic asbestos. Storing and indexing keystrokes is unique, and it

Storing keystrokes used to make a document reminds of a comparison between personal data and toxic asbestos. Storing and indexing keystrokes is unique, and it might even be useful, yes. However, this does not at all seem safe to store without user knowledge for every document created. What could possibly go wrong....

judge2020 6y ago
> without user knowledge File -> version history
- rement 6y ago
  To be fair there is also: share, new, open, make a copy, email, download, make available offline, rename, move, make a shortcut in drive, move to trash, publish to the web, document details, language, page setup, and print. That is just for the file menu. There are 7 other menus each with their own long list of options.
- boogies 6y ago
  IIRC the version history only shows snapshots hours apart. Not the sensitive info some of the millions of users have accidentally pasted in and deleted within seconds — which now everyone they share edit access with years later can see, as well as Alphabet and the various alphabet-soup agencies of the government they share a revolving door with.
asdfasgasdgasdg 6y ago
This has been a feature of Google Docs from jump. And it has never been a secret that you can browse doc version history.
- FartyMcFarter 6y ago
  Yes, but that version history is not as detailed as every keystroke, so it's not obvious that every keystroke is recorded.
wrnr 6y ago
This is just silly, I've worked on systems to write text and that is just wat you do to solve the problem of (collaborative) editing a document.
- drtillberg 6y ago
  It's just super interesting that the granular record is persistent and can be replayed years later. Pretty non-obvious to me, and something I usually pay attention to!
  - wrnr 6y ago
    The event log of key strokes is the source of truth for the entire document editing system, I can't think of a reason why one can't rewrite history after a certain time, except to say that this requirement will probably impact a lot of sub-systems from storage to UI, that now have to keep working under historical revisionism. I certainly haven't bothered doing that. It's probably one of those situations where you'd write a "Diversion Report" for the security team where you talk about limited assets at rist and a huge investment in engineering resources.
- jariel 6y ago
  You definitely don't need that level of granular detail from 10 years ago. There is no use-case for reproducing every keystroke. Major edits would be fine after literally only after a major save, or a day has passed. FYI - this is a kind of 'biometric' leakage eh. Your typing style is probably as unique as your finger print. It's not shockingly bad, but probably something, under thoughtful review, they should take care of. Edit: by 'no use case' I mean, no use case for long term history. Obviously there's a good use case for 'very short term' individual keystrokes. Also Edit: the answer to this issue is not 'Don't worry about it, it's a low risk problem'. This is the 'slow boil' SV way of thinking that is seemingly benign, but not acceptable in the long run. The answer is: don't store personal data that is unnecessary. It's that simple. It doesn't diminish the product a single bit.
  - asdfasgasdgasdg 6y ago

judge2020 6y ago

> without user knowledge File -> version history

rement 6y ago
To be fair there is also: share, new, open, make a copy, email, download, make available offline, rename, move, make a shortcut in drive, move to trash, publish to the web, document details, language, page setup, and print. That is just for the file menu. There are 7 other menus each with their own long list of options.
boogies 6y ago
IIRC the version history only shows snapshots hours apart. Not the sensitive info some of the millions of users have accidentally pasted in and deleted within seconds — which now everyone they share edit access with years later can see, as well as Alphabet and the various alphabet-soup agencies of the government they share a revolving door with.

asdfasgasdgasdg 6y ago

This has been a feature of Google Docs from jump. And it has never been a secret that you can browse doc version history.

FartyMcFarter 6y ago
Yes, but that version history is not as detailed as every keystroke, so it's not obvious that every keystroke is recorded.

wrnr 6y ago

This is just silly, I've worked on systems to write text and that is just wat you do to solve the problem of (collaborative) editing a document.

drtillberg 6y ago
It's just super interesting that the granular record is persistent and can be replayed years later. Pretty non-obvious to me, and something I usually pay attention to!
- wrnr 6y ago
  The event log of key strokes is the source of truth for the entire document editing system, I can't think of a reason why one can't rewrite history after a certain time, except to say that this requirement will probably impact a lot of sub-systems from storage to UI, that now have to keep working under historical revisionism. I certainly haven't bothered doing that. It's probably one of those situations where you'd write a "Diversion Report" for the security team where you talk about limited assets at rist and a huge investment in engineering resources.
jariel 6y ago
You definitely don't need that level of granular detail from 10 years ago. There is no use-case for reproducing every keystroke. Major edits would be fine after literally only after a major save, or a day has passed. FYI - this is a kind of 'biometric' leakage eh. Your typing style is probably as unique as your finger print. It's not shockingly bad, but probably something, under thoughtful review, they should take care of. Edit: by 'no use case' I mean, no use case for long term history. Obviously there's a good use case for 'very short term' individual keystrokes. Also Edit: the answer to this issue is not 'Don't worry about it, it's a low risk problem'. This is the 'slow boil' SV way of thinking that is seemingly benign, but not acceptable in the long run. The answer is: don't store personal data that is unnecessary. It's that simple. It doesn't diminish the product a single bit.
- asdfasgasdgasdg 6y ago