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It's hard not to reflect on Steve Job's quotes like that and think about how Apple manufactures it's phones. What a reality they've created for the foxcon worke

It's hard not to reflect on Steve Job's quotes like that and think about how Apple manufactures it's phones. What a reality they've created for the foxcon workers.

0x10c0fe11ce 6y ago
One could argue they’re just following local laws. Though it won’t make any difference because their brand carries such weight and status that I find it will be almost impossible to vote it out with our wallets. We’d better shut up and just accept the new truth from our self appointed feudal masters.
- AsyncAwait 6y ago
  > One could argue they’re just following local laws. One couldn't argue that as they knew about Chinese labor law violations at Foxconn & Pegatron. Do you seriously think China has laws that mandate abuse of workers?
  - toyg 6y ago
    Replace “laws” with “customs” and the sentence works. The Chinese leadership doesn’t care about its citizenry as long as $$$ keeps flowing. They are hardly unique in that, of course, but they’re more blatant than others.
    - AsyncAwait 6y ago
      I honestly think that's a simplistic view that allows us in the West to feel better about how terribly we're taking care of our own people. Just look at the U.S. handling of COVID and how there's still no universal healthcare. China did a much better job here even if you think their figures aren't exact, (most likely true, but so is the case in places like Florida etc.) I don't think they're somehow uniquely more corrupt that here in the West, they're however much younger, (convenient how we disregard our meddling there for centuries), they're trying to match the West in as short timespan as possible and of course they're going to line up their pockets along the way, as almost everyone with enough power and access does when given the chance, sadly. But they've also massively expanded the middle class and lifted people from poverty. Remember the U.S. had slavery and yes it is appropriate to compare that since the U.S. had the same government then than it does now, China didn't. As China grows in strength and prosperity so do its laws become more worker friendly as it transitions from a factory for the world to a more knowledge based economy. In other words it follows a fairly standard development trajectory, just on a much shorter timeframe so the abuses are more visible and less spread out, unlike in the West. Plus there's more technology to document it all.
AntiImperialis2 6y ago
The reality that they have created for Foxconn workers is that they have a job that they would die than quit. It's that important to them. Why do you assume that it has to be Apple's fault that China is fucked up?
- ric2b 6y ago
  > they have a job that they would die than quit. It's that important to them. Or maybe simply quitting would be even worse than taking their own lives, somehow. And Foxconn might be part of making that situation a reality.
theshrike79 6y ago
You do know that Foxconn has over 800k employees around the world? And that they manufacture a huge amount of the electronics we all use every day. For some reason the notion of Foxcon == Apple manufacturer has stuck in the public consciousness, mostly because it brings in the sweet sweet clicks just by having "Apple manufacturer <bad thing>" in there.

It's hard not to reflect on Steve Job's quotes like that and think about how Apple manufactures it's phones. What a reality they've created for the foxcon workers.

0x10c0fe11ce 6y ago

One could argue they’re just following local laws. Though it won’t make any difference because their brand carries such weight and status that I find it will be almost impossible to vote it out with our wallets. We’d better shut up and just accept the new truth from our self appointed feudal masters.

AsyncAwait 6y ago
> One could argue they’re just following local laws. One couldn't argue that as they knew about Chinese labor law violations at Foxconn & Pegatron. Do you seriously think China has laws that mandate abuse of workers?
- toyg 6y ago
  Replace “laws” with “customs” and the sentence works. The Chinese leadership doesn’t care about its citizenry as long as $$$ keeps flowing. They are hardly unique in that, of course, but they’re more blatant than others.
  - AsyncAwait 6y ago
    I honestly think that's a simplistic view that allows us in the West to feel better about how terribly we're taking care of our own people. Just look at the U.S. handling of COVID and how there's still no universal healthcare. China did a much better job here even if you think their figures aren't exact, (most likely true, but so is the case in places like Florida etc.) I don't think they're somehow uniquely more corrupt that here in the West, they're however much younger, (convenient how we disregard our meddling there for centuries), they're trying to match the West in as short timespan as possible and of course they're going to line up their pockets along the way, as almost everyone with enough power and access does when given the chance, sadly. But they've also massively expanded the middle class and lifted people from poverty. Remember the U.S. had slavery and yes it is appropriate to compare that since the U.S. had the same government then than it does now, China didn't. As China grows in strength and prosperity so do its laws become more worker friendly as it transitions from a factory for the world to a more knowledge based economy. In other words it follows a fairly standard development trajectory, just on a much shorter timeframe so the abuses are more visible and less spread out, unlike in the West. Plus there's more technology to document it all.

AntiImperialis2 6y ago

The reality that they have created for Foxconn workers is that they have a job that they would die than quit. It's that important to them. Why do you assume that it has to be Apple's fault that China is fucked up?

ric2b 6y ago
> they have a job that they would die than quit. It's that important to them. Or maybe simply quitting would be even worse than taking their own lives, somehow. And Foxconn might be part of making that situation a reality.

theshrike79 6y ago

You do know that Foxconn has over 800k employees around the world? And that they manufacture a huge amount of the electronics we all use every day. For some reason the notion of Foxcon == Apple manufacturer has stuck in the public consciousness, mostly because it brings in the sweet sweet clicks just by having "Apple manufacturer <bad thing>" in there.