3 ms·

Sounds like MS, Google and FB has just confirmed that they store in their database information allowing "surveil" on people. Good we have that stated clearly.

Sounds like MS, Google and FB has just confirmed that they store in their database information allowing "surveil" on people. Good we have that stated clearly. Big Guys, solution is simple: just delete or anonymize those data, so it is not possible to surveil people, you will not have to fight legal battles and NSO will not try to break into your database. In addition you will avoid temptation to surveil people by yourself! And you will not need to hand over these data to parties that are able to force you do this. Be that Chinese government or FBI or some other 3 letter agency.

stingraycharles 6y ago
> Big Guys, solution is simple: just delete or anonymize those data, so it is not possible to surveil people, you will not have to fight legal battles and NSO will not try to break into your database. Playing the devil’s advocate: isn’t it mandated for them to actually track people, in case some 3-letter government agency wants access?
- bbarnett 6y ago
  Tracking is different than historical data, for tracking can be a live, forwarded feed. And even with that, you'd need a court order to force compulsion. Historical data, if it doesn't exist, cannot be revealed. And so far, there is no legislation forcing web activity to be stored for, well, months and years, like some of these jokers do.
- Frost1x 6y ago
  I doubt the sort of tracking government agencies push or request from them is nearly as detailed as what they're currently collecting for advertising. It's not that such agencies that spy on their own citizens don't want such information, its likely that they don't know just what derived information products are available to even make the requests. Technology is making anonymity nearly impossible in all facets of life and I don't think that's healthy for human development. Sometimes you need to assume an identity know one else knows so you can try things, fail, and develop socially as a person without fear of harming your identity. People need to be able to experiment and fail without fear of repercussion (obviously within legal bounds of what they're doing). I need to be able to walk in a bar, get drunk, and "sing" karaoke embarrassingly poorly and not have everyone at work the next day ostracize that behavior and have video evidence of it (just an example). Anonymity often grants failure and adventure without criticism and the direction we're headed is going to stiffle people's ability to explore themselves and life.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - zarp 6y ago
    > Technology is making anonymity nearly impossible in all facets of life and I don't think that's healthy for human development. This sentiment is dying at an alarming rate. Even here, after reading some of these comments I am taken aback at how normalized the idea of total surveillance has become. It doesn't matter where it comes from, big corp or big gov, taking away personal privacy takes away a fundamental part of what makes us human. It's not healthy. It's not right. Fight this.
nova22033 6y ago
The data in question was probably WhatsApp/iMessage messages and e-mails. And the data was stolen from the victims device. I actually want my phone to keep my messages until I chose to delete them.
- rossdavidh 6y ago
  It does suggest a possible new privacy-respecting phone, though, that does not store any phone numbers, messages, voicemails, or other sensitive information. It also does not allow any telecom or other organization like NSO to monitor your phone calls, because it doesn't allow you to make any. We could call it the iBrick (tm).
  - nova22033 6y ago
    We could call it the iBrick (tm) you laugh but the apple store search logs probably have 10k hits for iBrick after you posted this.
jsnell 6y ago
You appear to have totally misunderstood what happened. This case is about NSO using a vulnerability in WhatsApp's client application, to do nasty things client-side. It is not about anything stored in server side databases.

stingraycharles 6y ago

> Big Guys, solution is simple: just delete or anonymize those data, so it is not possible to surveil people, you will not have to fight legal battles and NSO will not try to break into your database. Playing the devil’s advocate: isn’t it mandated for them to actually track people, in case some 3-letter government agency wants access?

bbarnett 6y ago
Tracking is different than historical data, for tracking can be a live, forwarded feed. And even with that, you'd need a court order to force compulsion. Historical data, if it doesn't exist, cannot be revealed. And so far, there is no legislation forcing web activity to be stored for, well, months and years, like some of these jokers do.
Frost1x 6y ago
I doubt the sort of tracking government agencies push or request from them is nearly as detailed as what they're currently collecting for advertising. It's not that such agencies that spy on their own citizens don't want such information, its likely that they don't know just what derived information products are available to even make the requests. Technology is making anonymity nearly impossible in all facets of life and I don't think that's healthy for human development. Sometimes you need to assume an identity know one else knows so you can try things, fail, and develop socially as a person without fear of harming your identity. People need to be able to experiment and fail without fear of repercussion (obviously within legal bounds of what they're doing). I need to be able to walk in a bar, get drunk, and "sing" karaoke embarrassingly poorly and not have everyone at work the next day ostracize that behavior and have video evidence of it (just an example). Anonymity often grants failure and adventure without criticism and the direction we're headed is going to stiffle people's ability to explore themselves and life.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- zarp 6y ago
  > Technology is making anonymity nearly impossible in all facets of life and I don't think that's healthy for human development. This sentiment is dying at an alarming rate. Even here, after reading some of these comments I am taken aback at how normalized the idea of total surveillance has become. It doesn't matter where it comes from, big corp or big gov, taking away personal privacy takes away a fundamental part of what makes us human. It's not healthy. It's not right. Fight this.

nova22033 6y ago

The data in question was probably WhatsApp/iMessage messages and e-mails. And the data was stolen from the victims device. I actually want my phone to keep my messages until I chose to delete them.

rossdavidh 6y ago
It does suggest a possible new privacy-respecting phone, though, that does not store any phone numbers, messages, voicemails, or other sensitive information. It also does not allow any telecom or other organization like NSO to monitor your phone calls, because it doesn't allow you to make any. We could call it the iBrick (tm).
- nova22033 6y ago
  We could call it the iBrick (tm) you laugh but the apple store search logs probably have 10k hits for iBrick after you posted this.

jsnell 6y ago

You appear to have totally misunderstood what happened. This case is about NSO using a vulnerability in WhatsApp's client application, to do nasty things client-side. It is not about anything stored in server side databases.