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I don't see it going away as there are valid reasons for doing so for small but important market differences. If you're making some device (for example, washin

I don't see it going away as there are valid reasons for doing so for small but important market differences. If you're making some device (for example, washing machine) which has a power cord and a knob for some mode selection with writing on it, then for the exact same internals you need different models where the power cords are different (USA, UK, Germany and Japan each require different plugs) and the writing on the device is printed in different language and with customizations such as Celsius vs Fahrenheit. You can't sell the exact same laptop model in every market because the keyboard layouts are different. Etc.

Retric 6y ago
Just append the region identifier to the model number. Internally they clearly need to track the products separately, and you don’t want people getting the wrong product accidentally.
mschuster91 6y ago
> then for the exact same internals you need different models where the power cords are different The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern.
- Matt3o12_ 6y ago
  > The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern. I'm not sure what you mean by the second sentence but you can't use most appliances made for Europe in America and vice versa. Most electronic appliances depend on the input voltage and supplying 240V can easily cause a fire. That is true for almost all electronic appliances (water heater, fan, washing machine, etc) but not true most "computer related devices" such as a monitor, PSU, charger. Since those devices already operate on a much lower DC Voltage, they often have transformers (not sure if that's the right word), that can scale down the current from either 120 or 240. [0] That being said, a mandatory IEC connector (and it's variances) would help a lot to cut down unnecessary e-waste. Instead of throwing away a device because the cable is damaged, you can easily order a replacement that is around $2 and high quality, instead of relying third party cords that might have bad wiring from a non reputable brand. The reason they are not mandatory, though, is that most companies like to have their own connectors so that you either overpay for it or just buy a new device. [0]: You should still always read the specs on the input current for the device though. It is dangerous to rely on the fact that similar devices can operate at 120V/240V because yours might not. You can usually see the specs on the website/packaging or usually near the input plug.
  - wongarsu 6y ago
    My cheap hair drier has a switch to select the input voltage (you need to turn the dial with a screwdriver). For many devices it shouldn't be too hard to make it possible to use them both with 110V and 230V, even more so for already complex and expensive machines like a washing machine. The biggest problem might be the amount of power a device can draw. Half the voltage gives you half the power, which is the reason why e.g. kettles are much less useful in the US.
    - stan_rogers 6y ago
      For resistive loads (like the heating element in a kettle), half the voltage gives you a quarter of the power. (Electric kettles work just fine on 110/120; they just haven't been a thing in the US. They've been ubiquitous in Canada, although they've been pushed aside somewhat by drip coffee makers. You just need a lower-resistance heating element than would be practical with 220/240.)
      - wongarsu 6y ago
        Electric kettles in the US typically are 1000W-1500W, while in Europe any kettle is 2000W-2800W. This is simply because houses are typically wired with outlets for 10A-16A everywhere, regardless of grid voltage. That ofc makes electric kettles much less useful in countries with 110V grid. It also keeps stovetop kettles relevant in these counties, since stoves don't suffer power limitations.
        oftenwrong 6y ago
        Houses in the US are typically wired with 240v split phase, so nothing is stopping a mad lad from installing a 240v outlet in their kitchen, and running a kettle from it.
  - eznzt 6y ago
    This just seems so crazy, to think of 120V. I haven't seen a house here with 120V in my entire lifetime. It sounds like a relic from the past, like the kind of thing people used back when they rode horses.
pezezin 6y ago
Japan uses the same power plugs as the USA.
majewsky 6y ago
> you need different models where the power cords are different That should only affec the power brick, and hence the overall SKU, not the notebook itself. > the writing on the device is printed in different language and with customizations such as Celsius vs Fahrenheit. What writing is there on notebooks except for keyboard labeling and the product name? The certification label on the back already shows all labels for all countries. > You can't sell the exact same laptop model in every market because the keyboard layouts are different. Keyboard layouts are somewhat orthogonal to regions. I'm German, but use US-layout keyboards.

Retric 6y ago

Just append the region identifier to the model number. Internally they clearly need to track the products separately, and you don’t want people getting the wrong product accidentally.

mschuster91 6y ago

> then for the exact same internals you need different models where the power cords are different The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern.

Matt3o12_ 6y ago
> The IEC 60320 connectors were specified for exactly that reason. Honestly, I don't get why these were not made mandatory for all kinds of appliances. There are even locking variants available if vibration is of concern. I'm not sure what you mean by the second sentence but you can't use most appliances made for Europe in America and vice versa. Most electronic appliances depend on the input voltage and supplying 240V can easily cause a fire. That is true for almost all electronic appliances (water heater, fan, washing machine, etc) but not true most "computer related devices" such as a monitor, PSU, charger. Since those devices already operate on a much lower DC Voltage, they often have transformers (not sure if that's the right word), that can scale down the current from either 120 or 240. [0] That being said, a mandatory IEC connector (and it's variances) would help a lot to cut down unnecessary e-waste. Instead of throwing away a device because the cable is damaged, you can easily order a replacement that is around $2 and high quality, instead of relying third party cords that might have bad wiring from a non reputable brand. The reason they are not mandatory, though, is that most companies like to have their own connectors so that you either overpay for it or just buy a new device. [0]: You should still always read the specs on the input current for the device though. It is dangerous to rely on the fact that similar devices can operate at 120V/240V because yours might not. You can usually see the specs on the website/packaging or usually near the input plug.
- wongarsu 6y ago
  My cheap hair drier has a switch to select the input voltage (you need to turn the dial with a screwdriver). For many devices it shouldn't be too hard to make it possible to use them both with 110V and 230V, even more so for already complex and expensive machines like a washing machine. The biggest problem might be the amount of power a device can draw. Half the voltage gives you half the power, which is the reason why e.g. kettles are much less useful in the US.
  - stan_rogers 6y ago
    For resistive loads (like the heating element in a kettle), half the voltage gives you a quarter of the power. (Electric kettles work just fine on 110/120; they just haven't been a thing in the US. They've been ubiquitous in Canada, although they've been pushed aside somewhat by drip coffee makers. You just need a lower-resistance heating element than would be practical with 220/240.)
    - wongarsu 6y ago
      Electric kettles in the US typically are 1000W-1500W, while in Europe any kettle is 2000W-2800W. This is simply because houses are typically wired with outlets for 10A-16A everywhere, regardless of grid voltage. That ofc makes electric kettles much less useful in countries with 110V grid. It also keeps stovetop kettles relevant in these counties, since stoves don't suffer power limitations.
      - oftenwrong 6y ago
        Houses in the US are typically wired with 240v split phase, so nothing is stopping a mad lad from installing a 240v outlet in their kitchen, and running a kettle from it.
- eznzt 6y ago
  This just seems so crazy, to think of 120V. I haven't seen a house here with 120V in my entire lifetime. It sounds like a relic from the past, like the kind of thing people used back when they rode horses.

pezezin 6y ago

Japan uses the same power plugs as the USA.

majewsky 6y ago

> you need different models where the power cords are different That should only affec the power brick, and hence the overall SKU, not the notebook itself. > the writing on the device is printed in different language and with customizations such as Celsius vs Fahrenheit. What writing is there on notebooks except for keyboard labeling and the product name? The certification label on the back already shows all labels for all countries. > You can't sell the exact same laptop model in every market because the keyboard layouts are different. Keyboard layouts are somewhat orthogonal to regions. I'm German, but use US-layout keyboards.