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It’s interesting that ivy students are trying to use their pedigree to get into tech. Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other profess

by kory 6y ago

It’s interesting that ivy students are trying to use their pedigree to get into tech. Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other professions, nor does it really look for one in applicants. There are many state schools that don’t require an insane ivy league resume to get into that have just as good or better paths to work in tech.

nyokodo 6y ago
Not to mention that, despite CS degrees being devilishly useful, college isn’t strictly necessary full stop. These days you can get your foot in the door via code schools. I worked with an excellent engineer who never went to college but apprenticed back when that was a thing, another very entrepreneurial former colleague just built up a portfolio in high school and became a contractor while his contemporaries were in college.
- _qulr 6y ago
  > These days you can get your foot in the door via code schools. I don't think Ivy League kids are looking to just get their foot in the door; they're looking to be at the top.
  - wegs 6y ago
    Yeah. The code school route has a pretty hard glass ceiling. I'm glad I took graduate coursework in advanced algorithms, signal processing, control systems, AI, etc. which followed on a course of differential equations, advanced linear algebra, probability, and so on. There is a difference in computer science curricula, with more than a little bit of correlation with which tier school you go to. Without a solid theoretical background, you can become a decent engineer building a database-backed web application, but there's a world of possibilities closed off to you. And those aren't skills you'll pick up on the job. If you're super-self-motivated, MOOCs and similar can do it, but I've found few adults able to invest the time to learn skills which don't have a pay-off for years. Differential equations or linear algebra aren't very helpful in isolation; it's the application which build on top of them which add value. That's a few semesters of study.
Melting_Harps 6y ago
> It’s interesting that ivy students are trying to use their pedigree to get into tech. Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other professions, nor does it really look for one in applicants. I used to believe that, since I knew so many self taught coders become pretty successful 10-15 years ago. But the typical Stanford grad to FAANG route has become a total laughable mockery of its former 'build shit to gain a reputation' ethos but explains why their is so much corruption in University admissions. You can still be pretty successful without a university degree with the right connections, but now with so much unemployment and significant applicant noise to signal ratio I think we will continue to see this as the norm. Which is how so many founders get their start anyhow; Elon's story of being a shy nerd waiting in the lobby of a tech company hoping to talk to someone to no avail comes to mind being perhaps the most famous of this phenomenon. With that said, I think this how the toxic Ivy league mentality of entitlement happens; they often justify their entitlement as something they deserve after years/decades of not 'living life enough.'
- gnusty_gnurc 6y ago
  What's always been striking to me is seeing the pervasive humanistic, liberal attitude at a place like Princeton. People there must somehow deal with the dissonance of being the best example of entrenched privilege, absurd wealth, sophistication, luxury, comfort. Yet anytime I've been there it's all about the virtues of egalitarianism, inclusivity, etc. A jarring juxtaposition of rhetoric/reality. > they often justify their entitlement as something they deserve after years/decades of not 'living life enough.' Possibly, although I suspect it's more an ego phenomenon. Where they're all aware they've hit the jackpot in global relative terms, but they see this as some type of weird manifest destiny and duty where they're now tasked with using their privilege to be elite agents of good in the world.
  - Melting_Harps 6y ago
    > Possibly, although I suspect it's more an ego phenomenon. Where they're all aware they've hit the jackpot in global relative terms, but they see this as some type of weird manifest destiny and duty where they're now tasked with using their privilege to be elite agents of good in the world. I'm not saying it true, simply a rationalization they use to justify it which you can see and feel in their behaviour; the only person I ever knew from Princeton was an engineer ( afirst generation immigrant?) Indian or Arab family (I forget but recall his community pics) and he was always super helpful but also very reluctant to talk about 'campus life' and preferred to help us understand the math and engineering aspects behind certain things in a car forum. Not sure what happened to him, but this may explain why most like myself in University were completely over it by our sophomore year and openly bitched about it hindering our 'real lives' he, a PhD student at the time, was spending the majority of his time answering questions about things like unsprung mass, and analyzing home-brew ECU Turbo maps and hanging out with us at meetups eating BBQ with dirty, oily fingers than being amongst 'his own.'
_qulr 6y ago
> Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other professions Bill Gates: Harvard Mark Zuckerberg: Harvard Jeff Bezos: Princeton Eric Schmidt: Princeton Sundar Pichai: University of Pennsylvania (MBA) Elon Musk: University of Pennsylvania
- cafard 6y ago
  Stanford is in a climate maybe less favorable to ivy, but a) it has a degree of prestige, and b) its graduates have done OK in tech.

by kory 6y ago

nyokodo 6y ago

Not to mention that, despite CS degrees being devilishly useful, college isn’t strictly necessary full stop. These days you can get your foot in the door via code schools. I worked with an excellent engineer who never went to college but apprenticed back when that was a thing, another very entrepreneurial former colleague just built up a portfolio in high school and became a contractor while his contemporaries were in college.

_qulr 6y ago
> These days you can get your foot in the door via code schools. I don't think Ivy League kids are looking to just get their foot in the door; they're looking to be at the top.
- wegs 6y ago
  Yeah. The code school route has a pretty hard glass ceiling. I'm glad I took graduate coursework in advanced algorithms, signal processing, control systems, AI, etc. which followed on a course of differential equations, advanced linear algebra, probability, and so on. There is a difference in computer science curricula, with more than a little bit of correlation with which tier school you go to. Without a solid theoretical background, you can become a decent engineer building a database-backed web application, but there's a world of possibilities closed off to you. And those aren't skills you'll pick up on the job. If you're super-self-motivated, MOOCs and similar can do it, but I've found few adults able to invest the time to learn skills which don't have a pay-off for years. Differential equations or linear algebra aren't very helpful in isolation; it's the application which build on top of them which add value. That's a few semesters of study.

Melting_Harps 6y ago

> It’s interesting that ivy students are trying to use their pedigree to get into tech. Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other professions, nor does it really look for one in applicants. I used to believe that, since I knew so many self taught coders become pretty successful 10-15 years ago. But the typical Stanford grad to FAANG route has become a total laughable mockery of its former 'build shit to gain a reputation' ethos but explains why their is so much corruption in University admissions. You can still be pretty successful without a university degree with the right connections, but now with so much unemployment and significant applicant noise to signal ratio I think we will continue to see this as the norm. Which is how so many founders get their start anyhow; Elon's story of being a shy nerd waiting in the lobby of a tech company hoping to talk to someone to no avail comes to mind being perhaps the most famous of this phenomenon. With that said, I think this how the toxic Ivy league mentality of entitlement happens; they often justify their entitlement as something they deserve after years/decades of not 'living life enough.'

gnusty_gnurc 6y ago
What's always been striking to me is seeing the pervasive humanistic, liberal attitude at a place like Princeton. People there must somehow deal with the dissonance of being the best example of entrenched privilege, absurd wealth, sophistication, luxury, comfort. Yet anytime I've been there it's all about the virtues of egalitarianism, inclusivity, etc. A jarring juxtaposition of rhetoric/reality. > they often justify their entitlement as something they deserve after years/decades of not 'living life enough.' Possibly, although I suspect it's more an ego phenomenon. Where they're all aware they've hit the jackpot in global relative terms, but they see this as some type of weird manifest destiny and duty where they're now tasked with using their privilege to be elite agents of good in the world.
- Melting_Harps 6y ago
  > Possibly, although I suspect it's more an ego phenomenon. Where they're all aware they've hit the jackpot in global relative terms, but they see this as some type of weird manifest destiny and duty where they're now tasked with using their privilege to be elite agents of good in the world. I'm not saying it true, simply a rationalization they use to justify it which you can see and feel in their behaviour; the only person I ever knew from Princeton was an engineer ( afirst generation immigrant?) Indian or Arab family (I forget but recall his community pics) and he was always super helpful but also very reluctant to talk about 'campus life' and preferred to help us understand the math and engineering aspects behind certain things in a car forum. Not sure what happened to him, but this may explain why most like myself in University were completely over it by our sophomore year and openly bitched about it hindering our 'real lives' he, a PhD student at the time, was spending the majority of his time answering questions about things like unsprung mass, and analyzing home-brew ECU Turbo maps and hanging out with us at meetups eating BBQ with dirty, oily fingers than being amongst 'his own.'

_qulr 6y ago

> Tech itself isn’t impressed by an ivy university degree like other professions Bill Gates: Harvard Mark Zuckerberg: Harvard Jeff Bezos: Princeton Eric Schmidt: Princeton Sundar Pichai: University of Pennsylvania (MBA) Elon Musk: University of Pennsylvania

cafard 6y ago
Stanford is in a climate maybe less favorable to ivy, but a) it has a degree of prestige, and b) its graduates have done OK in tech.