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Kindness takes courage. There seem to be a lot of people who live at a level of abstraction where they perceive every interaction as being about dominance and

by warent 6y ago

Kindness takes courage. There seem to be a lot of people who live at a level of abstraction where they perceive every interaction as being about dominance and submission. In my humble opinion it is a very limited mindset. I consider myself to be generous person, and also slow to anger. As a result, there are people who think they hit the jackpot and found a submissive pushover who is like a flimsy tree that will bend over at the slightest breath of wind. Of course it's much more like being water; moving around obstacles, yet always forward and unstoppable. What matters is showing people that there can be real kindness and strength in the world. Sometimes it plants a seed for others to also have the courage to be kind. I believe that's how to make the world a better place. It sure makes life worth living.

taurath 6y ago
I think a lot of discussion here is conflating kindness with vulnerability. Kindness can sometimes mean vulnerability, but saying “no” is not inherently unkind. Kindness is also not necessarily self-sacrificing. You can have firm boundaries but be incredibly kind. Working out the differences to me has opened up a new level of relationships.
- the_arun 6y ago
  The key is practically selfless. For eg. You are buying food from restaurant - you see a homeless person standing there with a board asking for food. But you have money only to buy one sandwich. What do you do? 1. Say "no", because you too are hungry 2. Share half of the sandwich? 3. Giving whole sandwich & walk away as a saint? (3) is super kindness, but that needs different level of thinking & practice. Kindness we are talking here is (2). Your "no" point comes for the remaining half in (2).
closeparen 6y ago
Encountering people who live on that level can be a trip. I went to lunch with some classmates after lecture. I had been fixated on the content. But the salient facts to one of my classmates were instead: who had spoken, with how much confidence, how often, for how long, how the professor seemed to feel about it. It was eye opening. There was this whole other dimension to the room, which I could barely see, but to her it was front and center. I don’t aspire to be like that primarily or exclusively, but sometimes it’s helpful to notice and pay attention to.
- whatshisface 6y ago
  The funny thing is focusing on that will severely hamper your ability to perform in the actual conversation. Outside of gauging the reaction of the specific person you're talking to, if you want to score highly on the "talked for a long time with high confidence and everybody enjoyed it" axis you need to keep your eye on the ball so to speak.
- ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
  And yet everyone silently hates those people, people who waste everyone’s time just to prove how smart they are, usually failing in the process. There were always those people in my lectures.
  - JumpCrisscross 6y ago
    > everyone silently hates those people What? No. I don’t have a good sense for this. Having friends and colleagues and a partner with the focus and attention span for it is invaluable. Like it or not, power dynamics are real. And teams with someone tuned into their social dynamics can work better than one purely technical and aloof. Just because one doesn’t have a sense for a thing doesn’t make that thing despicable.
    - closeparen 6y ago
      I think he's talking about people who respond to the professor's questions in lecture.
      - ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
        Or worse, ask pointless questions just to prove they understand the content.
    - ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
      As the other child of this comment said, I’m not talking about being socially aware. I’m talking about people who are so obnoxious they turn everything into a competition so they can validate their own ego, quite the opposite of being socially aware. Lectures aren’t a competition of who said what.
geedy 6y ago
I love this. Any tips for doing this during a pandemic? Beyond just the usual of treating people well?
- warent 6y ago
  Specifically for the pandemic, I think there are many things. Post on a neighborhood community board (e.g. on reddit, nextdoor, etc) offering food (sanitized). Get toys for underprivileged children. Or, write letters to strangers in elderly care homes and/or prisons, who may not get to see family or have anyone who thinks about them.
unabst 6y ago
> Kindness takes courage. Not for a kind person. For a kind person it takes courage to be rude. It takes courage to say no, because it's so easy to say yes, because it feels good and it feels right (and I guess is also better for your health?). I would stop trying to change people or even thinking you can. Someone will pretend they changed all thanks to you, only to be themselves again later when they're done robbing you. There's a pervasive pattern of the narcissist type surrounded by submissive people and leaving a trail of submissive victims. These people are immediately repelled if they sense you're a waste of their efforts. When you're submissive, they'll take from you and betray you later. When you're not, they don't even ask. They reveal themselves immediately. But they make their money and build their empires by collecting those who yield to them and remain loyal despite occasional revelations of their true character or lack thereof. Trump could easily be seen as such a phenomenon. But most people who are OK with their job will yield to keep it (backed by the psychopathic behavior of corporations and their lack of character, because they aren't people). And many will submit just to make money (even to evil). So there are no shortage of such people to take advantage of. And the more people thrive by doing so, the more we create. Some may even become president. If you believe you're water, seek water. That is the best approach. Strengthen your water coalition. Stay healthy, strong, and happy. Once you're good, then fulfill your purpose.
austincheney 6y ago
> There seem to be a lot of people who live at a level of abstraction where they perceive every interaction as being about dominance and submission. In my humble opinion it is a very limited mindset. That is sociopathic so it isn’t always easy to identify but it’s easy to disregard. Kindness is generally a default. At a minimum it’s called mutual respect and at an absence it’s called being an asshole. It hardly takes any courage to be better than that. I cannot imagine the amount of medication people require if that is their definition of courage, as there isn’t any challenge there. Perhaps it’s a cultural difference.

by warent 6y ago

taurath 6y ago

I think a lot of discussion here is conflating kindness with vulnerability. Kindness can sometimes mean vulnerability, but saying “no” is not inherently unkind. Kindness is also not necessarily self-sacrificing. You can have firm boundaries but be incredibly kind. Working out the differences to me has opened up a new level of relationships.

the_arun 6y ago
The key is practically selfless. For eg. You are buying food from restaurant - you see a homeless person standing there with a board asking for food. But you have money only to buy one sandwich. What do you do? 1. Say "no", because you too are hungry 2. Share half of the sandwich? 3. Giving whole sandwich & walk away as a saint? (3) is super kindness, but that needs different level of thinking & practice. Kindness we are talking here is (2). Your "no" point comes for the remaining half in (2).

closeparen 6y ago

Encountering people who live on that level can be a trip. I went to lunch with some classmates after lecture. I had been fixated on the content. But the salient facts to one of my classmates were instead: who had spoken, with how much confidence, how often, for how long, how the professor seemed to feel about it. It was eye opening. There was this whole other dimension to the room, which I could barely see, but to her it was front and center. I don’t aspire to be like that primarily or exclusively, but sometimes it’s helpful to notice and pay attention to.

whatshisface 6y ago
The funny thing is focusing on that will severely hamper your ability to perform in the actual conversation. Outside of gauging the reaction of the specific person you're talking to, if you want to score highly on the "talked for a long time with high confidence and everybody enjoyed it" axis you need to keep your eye on the ball so to speak.
ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
And yet everyone silently hates those people, people who waste everyone’s time just to prove how smart they are, usually failing in the process. There were always those people in my lectures.
- JumpCrisscross 6y ago
  > everyone silently hates those people What? No. I don’t have a good sense for this. Having friends and colleagues and a partner with the focus and attention span for it is invaluable. Like it or not, power dynamics are real. And teams with someone tuned into their social dynamics can work better than one purely technical and aloof. Just because one doesn’t have a sense for a thing doesn’t make that thing despicable.
  - closeparen 6y ago
    I think he's talking about people who respond to the professor's questions in lecture.
    - ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
      Or worse, ask pointless questions just to prove they understand the content.
  - ytwySXpMbS 6y ago
    As the other child of this comment said, I’m not talking about being socially aware. I’m talking about people who are so obnoxious they turn everything into a competition so they can validate their own ego, quite the opposite of being socially aware. Lectures aren’t a competition of who said what.

geedy 6y ago

I love this. Any tips for doing this during a pandemic? Beyond just the usual of treating people well?

warent 6y ago
Specifically for the pandemic, I think there are many things. Post on a neighborhood community board (e.g. on reddit, nextdoor, etc) offering food (sanitized). Get toys for underprivileged children. Or, write letters to strangers in elderly care homes and/or prisons, who may not get to see family or have anyone who thinks about them.

unabst 6y ago

> Kindness takes courage. Not for a kind person. For a kind person it takes courage to be rude. It takes courage to say no, because it's so easy to say yes, because it feels good and it feels right (and I guess is also better for your health?). I would stop trying to change people or even thinking you can. Someone will pretend they changed all thanks to you, only to be themselves again later when they're done robbing you. There's a pervasive pattern of the narcissist type surrounded by submissive people and leaving a trail of submissive victims. These people are immediately repelled if they sense you're a waste of their efforts. When you're submissive, they'll take from you and betray you later. When you're not, they don't even ask. They reveal themselves immediately. But they make their money and build their empires by collecting those who yield to them and remain loyal despite occasional revelations of their true character or lack thereof. Trump could easily be seen as such a phenomenon. But most people who are OK with their job will yield to keep it (backed by the psychopathic behavior of corporations and their lack of character, because they aren't people). And many will submit just to make money (even to evil). So there are no shortage of such people to take advantage of. And the more people thrive by doing so, the more we create. Some may even become president. If you believe you're water, seek water. That is the best approach. Strengthen your water coalition. Stay healthy, strong, and happy. Once you're good, then fulfill your purpose.

austincheney 6y ago

> There seem to be a lot of people who live at a level of abstraction where they perceive every interaction as being about dominance and submission. In my humble opinion it is a very limited mindset. That is sociopathic so it isn’t always easy to identify but it’s easy to disregard. Kindness is generally a default. At a minimum it’s called mutual respect and at an absence it’s called being an asshole. It hardly takes any courage to be better than that. I cannot imagine the amount of medication people require if that is their definition of courage, as there isn’t any challenge there. Perhaps it’s a cultural difference.