5 ms·

lets leave the ponzi dreams over on your smf

by trotsky 15y ago

mike_esspe 15y ago
My partner dropped his work to work full time on bitcoin project back in February. I think he was one of the first, who have bitcoins as main income source. Currently bitcoin related projects are an unexplored land of possibilities :)
- shii 15y ago
  Could you elaborate on what he does and how it all works out? Sounds pretty fascinating, does he use Mt Gox or something else to convert to more recognized fiats? Does he (and you) have a backup plan in case things don't work out as planned with Bitcoin?
  - mike_esspe 15y ago
    Mining pool (http://deepbit.net http://deepbit.net). Yes, mtgox for now, though i hope that in a year or two i will be able to pay my rent with it directly :) Currently the growth is exponential, so it takes time to scale it. For me it's a side project, though it's becoming a large part of my income. If bitcoins fail - no big deal, just move on.
    - grondilu 15y ago
      I would definitely not be willing to pay my rent directly in bitcoins. It is much more interesting to pay in silly worthless fiat governmental currency.
      - mike_esspe 15y ago
        Currently to pay it i have to convert bitcoins to fiat currency (and lose around 2% in the process). I'd like to be able to skip this part.
- bhickey 15y ago
  I wonder how the IRS will choose to treat it. If you solve a block, have you made income or realized a capital gain? When you convert BTC into a national currency, what gain have you realized? (Current_price - Price_at_generation)? It seems like a legal minefield.
  - DavidParrish 15y ago
    Yeah, it's probably better to just not pay taxes. It is going to be difficult for the IRS to prove that you even own the Bitcoins with money laundering services and the ease of creating new accounts. As more merchants accept Bitcoin, I will try to convert to fiat currencies only when absolutely needed.
    - jhaglund 15y ago
      ^^this sums up my impression of the bitcoin community. Bitcoin is backed by what? Oh, right, scarcity.
      - waterlesscloud 15y ago
        I'm watching Bitcoin along two axes- One, how much value is notionally stored in the system. At this moment, it's roughly $51.4 million (6.192M bc at exchange of 8.3 usd), which is starting to be interesting. An order of magnitude higher, and it's definitely interesting. Two, what can actually be bought with the currency? This is still lagging considerably. It's almost entirely trinkets or not-very-interesting services that have no marginal cost to the producer. No one has put much faith in Bitcoin by putting their livelihood on the line with it, and that makes it less interesting. There's a fledgling trade in controlled substances via Silk Road, but having that as a primary example makes me considerably less interested. Not only am I not in the market for such, growth in this area virtually guarantees the ultimate failure of Bitcoin due to government action. The right approach to grow Bitcoin as an actual currency which is truly exchanged for goods and services is to offer something that people really want exclusively through Bitcoin. The extreme example would be the iPad. One producer, very high demand. Dollars (and thus value) would flood into the Bitcoin system with something like that. But where's the incentive for the producer? If you've got something people want, why would you offer it only via a currency no one uses? There's your core dilemma, and why it's all t-shirts and domain registrations.
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
cruzer 15y ago
There have been other attempts to make a currency with computers. However, bitcoin looks to have solved them. No central bank, dont just give them out for free, don't flood the market, Open Source, "Open Source", protect from dubble spending, and have really easy to work with API's. This is why I am behind the project. I totaly agree that any startup is going to be a big risk, but so far bitcoin seems to be taking off. Here is the bitcoin whitepaper which will show you how it works. http://myrelay.net/files/bitcoin.pdf http://myrelay.net/files/bitcoin.pdf Forbes.com http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0509/technology-psilocybin-bitcoins-gavin-andresen-crypto-currency.html http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0509/technology-psilocybin... ThisWeekinStartups http://thisweekinstartups.com/ http://thisweekinstartups.com/
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
pygy_ 15y ago
IMO, beside the current highly speculative valuations, the Bitcoin system has an intrinsic value derived from it's architecture. How much it is worth is another story.

lets leave the ponzi dreams over on your smf

by trotsky 15y ago

lets leave the ponzi dreams over on your smf

My partner dropped his work to work full time on bitcoin project back in February. I think he was one of the first, who have bitcoins as main income source. Currently bitcoin related projects are an unexplored land of possibilities :)

shii 15y ago
Could you elaborate on what he does and how it all works out? Sounds pretty fascinating, does he use Mt Gox or something else to convert to more recognized fiats? Does he (and you) have a backup plan in case things don't work out as planned with Bitcoin?
- mike_esspe 15y ago
  Mining pool (http://deepbit.net http://deepbit.net). Yes, mtgox for now, though i hope that in a year or two i will be able to pay my rent with it directly :) Currently the growth is exponential, so it takes time to scale it. For me it's a side project, though it's becoming a large part of my income. If bitcoins fail - no big deal, just move on.
  - grondilu 15y ago
    I would definitely not be willing to pay my rent directly in bitcoins. It is much more interesting to pay in silly worthless fiat governmental currency.
    - mike_esspe 15y ago
      Currently to pay it i have to convert bitcoins to fiat currency (and lose around 2% in the process). I'd like to be able to skip this part.
bhickey 15y ago
I wonder how the IRS will choose to treat it. If you solve a block, have you made income or realized a capital gain? When you convert BTC into a national currency, what gain have you realized? (Current_price - Price_at_generation)? It seems like a legal minefield.
- DavidParrish 15y ago
  Yeah, it's probably better to just not pay taxes. It is going to be difficult for the IRS to prove that you even own the Bitcoins with money laundering services and the ease of creating new accounts. As more merchants accept Bitcoin, I will try to convert to fiat currencies only when absolutely needed.
  - jhaglund 15y ago
    ^^this sums up my impression of the bitcoin community. Bitcoin is backed by what? Oh, right, scarcity.
    - waterlesscloud 15y ago
      I'm watching Bitcoin along two axes- One, how much value is notionally stored in the system. At this moment, it's roughly $51.4 million (6.192M bc at exchange of 8.3 usd), which is starting to be interesting. An order of magnitude higher, and it's definitely interesting. Two, what can actually be bought with the currency? This is still lagging considerably. It's almost entirely trinkets or not-very-interesting services that have no marginal cost to the producer. No one has put much faith in Bitcoin by putting their livelihood on the line with it, and that makes it less interesting. There's a fledgling trade in controlled substances via Silk Road, but having that as a primary example makes me considerably less interested. Not only am I not in the market for such, growth in this area virtually guarantees the ultimate failure of Bitcoin due to government action. The right approach to grow Bitcoin as an actual currency which is truly exchanged for goods and services is to offer something that people really want exclusively through Bitcoin. The extreme example would be the iPad. One producer, very high demand. Dollars (and thus value) would flood into the Bitcoin system with something like that. But where's the incentive for the producer? If you've got something people want, why would you offer it only via a currency no one uses? There's your core dilemma, and why it's all t-shirts and domain registrations.

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

cruzer 15y ago

There have been other attempts to make a currency with computers. However, bitcoin looks to have solved them. No central bank, dont just give them out for free, don't flood the market, Open Source, "Open Source", protect from dubble spending, and have really easy to work with API's. This is why I am behind the project. I totaly agree that any startup is going to be a big risk, but so far bitcoin seems to be taking off. Here is the bitcoin whitepaper which will show you how it works. http://myrelay.net/files/bitcoin.pdf http://myrelay.net/files/bitcoin.pdf Forbes.com http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0509/technology-psilocybin-bitcoins-gavin-andresen-crypto-currency.html http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0509/technology-psilocybin... ThisWeekinStartups http://thisweekinstartups.com/ http://thisweekinstartups.com/

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

pygy_ 15y ago

IMO, beside the current highly speculative valuations, the Bitcoin system has an intrinsic value derived from it's architecture. How much it is worth is another story.