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Are these really stolen antiquities? Even actual reputable auction houses tend to have quite a few fakes - surely the black markets would be flooded with them?
by ummonk 6y ago
Are these really stolen antiquities? Even actual reputable auction houses tend to have quite a few fakes - surely the black markets would be flooded with them?
- fortran77 6y agoThat was my first thought, too! A naïve (stolen-)antiquity buyer who sees offers on facebook would be a prime target for someone selling knockoffs. Get them made in China and sell them in Yemen! If the local authorities come after you, just show them that they're not real. It's really a win-win. See: https://blog.britishmuseum.org/fake-antiquities-made-for-unsuspecting-collectors/ https://blog.britishmuseum.org/fake-antiquities-made-for-uns... From this article: > This is evidence for a side of the trade in antiquities which is rarely discussed – there are more fakes in circulation than genuine articles. It is easier and cheaper to make copies than it is to hire dozens of workers to look for originals. Fakes can also be conveniently complete, whereas almost everything from antiquity has been broken, either deliberately in episodes of destruction, or accidentally in the case of everyday items. There is also the simple economic truth of the laws of supply and demand.
- londons_explore 6y agoDepends on the item - there are plenty of hand carved 300 year old statues and bits of furniture that would be far more expensive to fake than to just buy the real thing... Paying someone for a month to hand carve some intricate wood with metal inlays costs a lot more than $50 for some old junk antique, even at china labour rates.
- triceratops 6y ago> If the local authorities come after you, just show them that they're not real I've heard that selling fake illegal drugs (like passing off dried basil as cannabis in jurisdictions where the latter is illegal) is also illegal. Is the same true for illegal artifacts?
- shash 6y agoYes, often so - it would just come under the heading of fraud. The pity is, some of the fakes are themselves exquisite pieces.
- ineedasername 6y agoLike paintings indistinguishable from the original until a chemical analysis is performed on the pigment. At which point you really have to wonder at the monetary value placed on the original. To someone appreciating the piece visually, pretty much the whole point, what does it matter?
- pampa 6y agoThis topic has been explored since the advent of photography and cinema. When advances in technology allowed to produce indistinguishable copies. "The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction" (1935), by Walter Benjamin [1] is a good starting point on this topic. He was the first to ask what actually constitutes a work of art, if you can cheaply mass produce copies of it. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Work_of_Art_in_the_Age_of_Mechanical_Reproduction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Work_of_Art_in_the_Age_of_...
- pmiller2 6y agoYou can get charged with far more than fraud in the US, depending on the state. In Illinois, selling "look alike" drugs is a class 3 felony. [0] > A look-alike drug can be any substance that would lead a reasonable person to believe that the look-alike is the real thing, such as its color, consistency, dosage amount, shape or markings. Or a drug can be considered a look-alike if you imply or expressly represent that the look-alike is real. For example, a court can consider any statements you made in advertising or distributing the drug, whether you asked for money and how you packaged the look alike. [ibid] --- [0]: https://www.skokiecriminallawyer.com/2013/01/look-alike-drugs-felony-in-illinois.html https://www.skokiecriminallawyer.com/2013/01/look-alike-drug...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- wdb 6y agoEven actual reputable auction houses auction stolen antiquities or lots with dodgy provenance information. They don't care at Christies and similar houses. For example: https://www.christies.com/lot/lot-5546862/ https://www.christies.com/lot/lot-5546862/ Also don't forget eBay, plenty of stuff to find there too
- justapassenger 6y agoIt’s much less catchy headline “someone found some stolen antiques - more investigation needed”.
- mike00632 6y agoCan we step back and laugh at how all these comments agree that Facebook isn't reputable?
- edmundsauto 6y agoLet’s spare a breath for the also unreliable Craigslist, eBay, Sotheby’s, and the other high end auction houses that have also been used as a fence. In other words, a marketplace.
- topspin 6y agoFacebook is a carnival of random people involving themselves in whatever amuses them, including any nefarious scofflawery they can get away with. I find some humor and no little despair discovering that anyone ever expected much repute in such places.
- shash 6y agoSure, and all the "reputable" auction houses also have a whole lot of stolen ones. Read https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/408207.Sotheby_s https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/408207.Sotheby_s or https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/41218855-the-idol-thief https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/41218855-the-idol-thi... (the last is by a friend of mine) for example. As far as Indian art is concerned, almost everything on the market is either stolen, or fake.