3 ms·

Microsoft has a good track record with making games, but yes all of FAANG is terrible at this. I have a little more hope for Facebook now that they've started a

Microsoft has a good track record with making games, but yes all of FAANG is terrible at this. I have a little more hope for Facebook now that they've started acquiring studios and letting them run independently, instead of the previous combination of publishing\funding and having few internal game teams (which generally doesn't work in big tech anyway). This could lead to a model that looks more like Microsoft Game Studios.

dougmwne 6y ago
One of the best VR experiences out there was made by a single dev, Eleven Table Tennis. Most of what Facebook puts out there is mediocre tech demos and they don't seem to understand the strengths of their own platform enough to take advantage of them in their games.
an_opabinia 6y ago
> I have a little more hope for Facebook now that they've started acquiring studios and letting them run independently The reality is, the acquisition of best VR game of any objective measure, Beat Saber, set back VR for all game developers because it will rob other VR platforms of a doorbuster title (i.e. Beat Saber 2). Also, it enables Beat Games to keep using unlicensed music by fiat of Facebook's legal might, a completely unassailable competitive advantage that is strictly better than actually licensing the music and making a game with it. It is illustrative of how the things giant companies are good at, which is using their huge cash piles to achieve totally anti-competitive advantages, changes nothing for the status quo of the consumer - they don't pay for the music no matter who the game's owner is - but just winds up harming other game developers. Consider also Facebook Horizon is seeking to replace VR Chat, I believe the #1 free VR title by installs. How is that benefitting game developers and gaming culture? Just compare a screenshot of VR Chat here (1) to Facebook Horizon here (2), it tells you everything you need to know about why the kind of people who work at giant companies are awful at making games. It's so fucking sterile dude, and it's sterile on purpose. People have said this for eons about Disney, but it's not comparable. By the way, Disney also totally blundered Disney Interactive, shutting down under the CEO Bob Iger who was known as the "tech" CEO of Disney. (1) https://miro.medium.com/max/3840/1*I5c-QMDHVPeyC35pM1V4Ng.png https://miro.medium.com/max/3840/1*I5c-QMDHVPeyC35pM1V4Ng.pn... (2) https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/9kGJANvUNFtxp5mGEgMIDI95DnA=/1200x675/2019/09/27/4bce2f4b-8d1f-4335-859c-5bd0a649728a/friends.png https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/9kGJANvUNFtxp5mGEgMIDI95DnA...
- Impossible 6y ago
  I worked on the Horizon team, and there's only so much I'm comfortable saying, but I can say the team burnt me out and I quit. There isn't a 100% chance that Beat Saber 2 will be exclusive, but you're right that it's likely and if that happens it will be a shame. My hope is that Facebook moving away from PC VR as a focus means they won't see it as competition, and start releasing previously exclusive games on Steam in the same way Microsoft and Sony have started releasing previously console exclusive titles, but I won't hold my breath.
  - an_opabinia 6y ago
    Well by no means I meant to shit on what you do, it is of course going to be a well engineered and nice product. I understand it's tough in most roles to do anything about like, sterility - it's above everyone's pay grade at giant companies. So please take it with a bit of exaggeration, it's certainly frustrating as an outsider to see that kind of money lit on fire and talented people getting burnt out. A more experienced and culturally thoughtful decision maker would do things differently.
- ipsum2 6y ago
  > Also, it enables Beat Games to keep using unlicensed music Huh? All BeatSaber music are originals or licensed.

dougmwne 6y ago

One of the best VR experiences out there was made by a single dev, Eleven Table Tennis. Most of what Facebook puts out there is mediocre tech demos and they don't seem to understand the strengths of their own platform enough to take advantage of them in their games.

an_opabinia 6y ago

> I have a little more hope for Facebook now that they've started acquiring studios and letting them run independently The reality is, the acquisition of best VR game of any objective measure, Beat Saber, set back VR for all game developers because it will rob other VR platforms of a doorbuster title (i.e. Beat Saber 2). Also, it enables Beat Games to keep using unlicensed music by fiat of Facebook's legal might, a completely unassailable competitive advantage that is strictly better than actually licensing the music and making a game with it. It is illustrative of how the things giant companies are good at, which is using their huge cash piles to achieve totally anti-competitive advantages, changes nothing for the status quo of the consumer - they don't pay for the music no matter who the game's owner is - but just winds up harming other game developers. Consider also Facebook Horizon is seeking to replace VR Chat, I believe the #1 free VR title by installs. How is that benefitting game developers and gaming culture? Just compare a screenshot of VR Chat here (1) to Facebook Horizon here (2), it tells you everything you need to know about why the kind of people who work at giant companies are awful at making games. It's so fucking sterile dude, and it's sterile on purpose. People have said this for eons about Disney, but it's not comparable. By the way, Disney also totally blundered Disney Interactive, shutting down under the CEO Bob Iger who was known as the "tech" CEO of Disney. (1) https://miro.medium.com/max/3840/1*I5c-QMDHVPeyC35pM1V4Ng.png https://miro.medium.com/max/3840/1*I5c-QMDHVPeyC35pM1V4Ng.pn... (2) https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/9kGJANvUNFtxp5mGEgMIDI95DnA=/1200x675/2019/09/27/4bce2f4b-8d1f-4335-859c-5bd0a649728a/friends.png https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/9kGJANvUNFtxp5mGEgMIDI95DnA...

Impossible 6y ago
I worked on the Horizon team, and there's only so much I'm comfortable saying, but I can say the team burnt me out and I quit. There isn't a 100% chance that Beat Saber 2 will be exclusive, but you're right that it's likely and if that happens it will be a shame. My hope is that Facebook moving away from PC VR as a focus means they won't see it as competition, and start releasing previously exclusive games on Steam in the same way Microsoft and Sony have started releasing previously console exclusive titles, but I won't hold my breath.
- an_opabinia 6y ago
  Well by no means I meant to shit on what you do, it is of course going to be a well engineered and nice product. I understand it's tough in most roles to do anything about like, sterility - it's above everyone's pay grade at giant companies. So please take it with a bit of exaggeration, it's certainly frustrating as an outsider to see that kind of money lit on fire and talented people getting burnt out. A more experienced and culturally thoughtful decision maker would do things differently.
ipsum2 6y ago
> Also, it enables Beat Games to keep using unlicensed music Huh? All BeatSaber music are originals or licensed.