4 ms·

If you stipulate that 'Rust is going to yield a lot of result when it comes to security, memory safety and maintainability' (see parent comment), then a great m

If you stipulate that 'Rust is going to yield a lot of result when it comes to security, memory safety and maintainability' (see parent comment), then a great many Internet users out there would choose Firefox if as a result of being written in Rust it's more secure, memory-safe (less crashing/bugs) and maintainable (more and better features).

tleb_ 6y ago
Maybe in the Hacker News bubble but that's not "a great many Internet users". People either use what is pre-installed, what they are used to or what their techy friend recommended them.
- naniwaduni 6y ago
  That "what their techy friend recommended them" does a hell of a lot of work. It pretty much drove Firefox up to 30% market share once, remember.
  - emn13 6y ago
    A counter point to that is that the impact of the tech sector on recommendations like that is ever shrinking - tech is normalized; everyday stuff where people feel comfortable making their own choices (and where the number of people that haven't made those choices pretty solidly yet is ever shrinking). The market is more mature, in essence.
    - methodsignature 6y ago
      Yap. People ask the internet now maybe more than their techie friends, and the marketers are probably as likely to be the ones amswering.
  - TheAdamAndChe 6y ago
    I think it's why Firefox's market share is declining too. I don't recommend firefox for non-technical users anymore because of its relative complexity and incompatibility with the modern web when compared to Chrome.
    - tleb_ 6y ago
      What complexity are you referring to? And do you actually encounter issues while browsing using Firefox? I am curious as I don't relate to this and recommend Firefox to friends and family.
      - curryst 6y ago
        I've seen things that don't work quite right in Firefox. The Zoom webapp doesn't recognize some of my audio devices, but Chrome does. The Citrix gateway also fails to log in on Firefox sometimes. I don't know whether those are bugs in Firefox or if Chrome is doing something funky that causes it to work but not Firefox.
        mr_toad 6y ago
        Zoom is using experimental API in production. Just another on a list of their cowboy tricks. I haven’t tried using Citrix for years. It used to work fine in Firefox, but given the quality of it I wouldn’t be surprised if they’ve broken something.
        zbentley 6y ago
        > Zoom is using experimental API in production. Just another on a list of their cowboy tricks. My uncle (who clicks on popup ads, and installed spyware twice a day until he got a non-admin account on a non-Windows OS last year) doesn't care about that. He doesn't know what an experimental API is. He wants to click the thing and have a video call open with his coworkers, kid's teacher, and family. There are alternatives. None of those people use them. This is how open standards die: by convenience and cowboy tricks. Get with it.
        mr_toad 6y ago
        If you do this you run the risk of having the rug pulled out from under you. All those LOB applications that were designed for IE only have basically been left high and dry. Nobody wants to support or use IE anymore, and the applications that require it don’t look so good any more.
wpietri 6y ago
Firefox is already sufficiently secure and low-crash for my tastes. I guess it's possible that more features would benefit me, but I'm not convinced.
Barrin92 6y ago
Neither Firefox or Chrome right now crash for me, they're actually both very stable and have been for a while, and memory consumption and performance bottlenecks seem to have largely moved from the browser engines themselves to the rich web applications. I'm not convinced changes to the browsers themselves at this point is anything other than a very marginal improvement.
twblalock 6y ago
Changing languages is not a magic bullet. Browsers written in C++ can be just as safe and maintainable -- especially with the resources of large companies behind them, with tons of engineers and testers etc.

tleb_ 6y ago

Maybe in the Hacker News bubble but that's not "a great many Internet users". People either use what is pre-installed, what they are used to or what their techy friend recommended them.

naniwaduni 6y ago
That "what their techy friend recommended them" does a hell of a lot of work. It pretty much drove Firefox up to 30% market share once, remember.
- emn13 6y ago
  A counter point to that is that the impact of the tech sector on recommendations like that is ever shrinking - tech is normalized; everyday stuff where people feel comfortable making their own choices (and where the number of people that haven't made those choices pretty solidly yet is ever shrinking). The market is more mature, in essence.
  - methodsignature 6y ago
    Yap. People ask the internet now maybe more than their techie friends, and the marketers are probably as likely to be the ones amswering.
- TheAdamAndChe 6y ago
  I think it's why Firefox's market share is declining too. I don't recommend firefox for non-technical users anymore because of its relative complexity and incompatibility with the modern web when compared to Chrome.
  - tleb_ 6y ago
    What complexity are you referring to? And do you actually encounter issues while browsing using Firefox? I am curious as I don't relate to this and recommend Firefox to friends and family.
    - curryst 6y ago
      I've seen things that don't work quite right in Firefox. The Zoom webapp doesn't recognize some of my audio devices, but Chrome does. The Citrix gateway also fails to log in on Firefox sometimes. I don't know whether those are bugs in Firefox or if Chrome is doing something funky that causes it to work but not Firefox.
      - mr_toad 6y ago
        Zoom is using experimental API in production. Just another on a list of their cowboy tricks. I haven’t tried using Citrix for years. It used to work fine in Firefox, but given the quality of it I wouldn’t be surprised if they’ve broken something.
        zbentley 6y ago
        > Zoom is using experimental API in production. Just another on a list of their cowboy tricks. My uncle (who clicks on popup ads, and installed spyware twice a day until he got a non-admin account on a non-Windows OS last year) doesn't care about that. He doesn't know what an experimental API is. He wants to click the thing and have a video call open with his coworkers, kid's teacher, and family. There are alternatives. None of those people use them. This is how open standards die: by convenience and cowboy tricks. Get with it.
        mr_toad 6y ago
        If you do this you run the risk of having the rug pulled out from under you. All those LOB applications that were designed for IE only have basically been left high and dry. Nobody wants to support or use IE anymore, and the applications that require it don’t look so good any more.

wpietri 6y ago

Firefox is already sufficiently secure and low-crash for my tastes. I guess it's possible that more features would benefit me, but I'm not convinced.

Barrin92 6y ago

Neither Firefox or Chrome right now crash for me, they're actually both very stable and have been for a while, and memory consumption and performance bottlenecks seem to have largely moved from the browser engines themselves to the rich web applications. I'm not convinced changes to the browsers themselves at this point is anything other than a very marginal improvement.

twblalock 6y ago

Changing languages is not a magic bullet. Browsers written in C++ can be just as safe and maintainable -- especially with the resources of large companies behind them, with tons of engineers and testers etc.