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While I do agree that crypto needs to step away from the current "investment vehicle" mentality and be treated more like a "currency"... I'm still lost how yet

While I do agree that crypto needs to step away from the current "investment vehicle" mentality and be treated more like a "currency"... I'm still lost how yet another currency is going to help society. Im not trying to be an ass, I'm being serious on figuring this out. I constantly see this argument with no real logic other than trying to essentially use Marxist ideals of "redistribution of wealth" to a disenfranchised demographic. Yet trying to distribute a computer based/useful currency to folks that dont have running water let alone electricity also confuses me. Tag on that the current distribution of bitcoin is in the realm of 30% of users own some 90% of bitcoin wealth. That's a pretty shitty interpretation of redistribution of wealth. In truth, it pretty much follows the realized implementation of Marxism throughout history, "everyone needs to redistribute wealth to me and my friends and away from the people who already have it". Just saying "this will help the poor because they have nothing" over and over with no real plan, let alone action, doesn't make it true. One guy I argued with once told me about him donating his bitcoins to buy pizzas for people who needed it. Which, cool. That's awesome. But the donation argument makes it sound like people dont donate dollars or euros. Or even like theres some grand mechanism that makes bitcoin better than traditional currencies... even though crypto gets converted to traditional currency so it can become useful.

pdpi 6y ago
> Just saying "this will help the poor because they have nothing" over and over with no real plan, let alone action, doesn't make it true. I used to work at a bitcoin company, and we had large user communities in countries where the local currency was subject to very high inflation, and access to stabler currencies (like dollars or euros) was severely limited. We were actually helping proper deal with real problems, and we were proud of it. Then the investment-tool-for-rich-white-kids mentality took over. :(
- NoOneNew 6y ago
  Okay... how does bitcoin differ from an unstable traditional currency? Both are subject to high and low swings to inflation and deflation. The one thing bitcoin has not been in its history is stable. This still ends up to being the equivalent to "there are 14 standards, let's make a standard to unify them... there are now 15 standards". Plus, all you described was a currency exchange with an extra step. You could replace bitcoin with rice commodity, wheat futures or Tesla stock and achieve the exact same thing. Again, "redistribute to my pocket" with extra steps. Look, I'm not trying to be a dick, but bitcoin was sold on the lie that it helps poor people. You're not wrong for wanting to help poor people. But people need to come to the realization that bitcoin has been Theranos-like the whole time. It's a waste of time if you're goal is to help the poor.
  - Torwald 6y ago
    In the discussed scenario, Bitcoin is more secure than a traditional currency. The local regime cannot take your Bitcoins away from you, which it could by hyperinflation, reform etc with the traditional currency. In other words, the trust in the owner of the currency is in fact higher. Local gangsters as well, cannot take your Bitcoins away from you as easily. You have a higher chance at keeping your stash.
    - jacinabox 6y ago
      > Local gangsters as well, cannot take your Bitcoins away from you as easily. You have a higher chance at keeping your stash. I can see what you're doing, you won't get away with this.
  - pdpi 6y ago
    Ranging 2015—mid 2017, BTC was slowly going up in price, in a nice steady fashion. It wasn’t until late 2017 that things went completely apeshit. At any rate, the price instability is exactly that — unstable. It’s not systematic hyperflation. For when you don’t have access to conventional forex, it’s better than nothing. > You're not wrong for wanting to help poor people. But people need to come to the realization that bitcoin has been Theranos-like the whole time. It's a waste of time if you're goal is to help the poor. Yeah. That’s a large part of why I used to work at a Bitcoin company.
mywittyname 6y ago
It's useful for moving money from countries with capital restrictions into USA dollars. I know a few people from SEA who use BTC for exactly this purpose.
- NoOneNew 6y ago
  You do understand the underlying principle as to why cross country capital transfer investigations are done... right? As a hint, look up cocaine cowboys and miami banks (particularly suntrust). While I get it's beneficial for average citizens looking to save a bit on tax/duty fees... it's a lot like wearing a condom when both of you dont care to know each other's name. You have that practice for a reason.
  - Torwald 6y ago
    In a country where the local regime is the party engaging in unethical, unlawful conduct, some factors change their algebraic sign.
alwillis 6y ago
Bitcoin is a non-sovereign, hard-capped supply, global, immutable, decentralized digital store of value. It’s an insurance policy against monetary and fiscal policy irresponsibility from central banks and governments globally.

pdpi 6y ago

> Just saying "this will help the poor because they have nothing" over and over with no real plan, let alone action, doesn't make it true. I used to work at a bitcoin company, and we had large user communities in countries where the local currency was subject to very high inflation, and access to stabler currencies (like dollars or euros) was severely limited. We were actually helping proper deal with real problems, and we were proud of it. Then the investment-tool-for-rich-white-kids mentality took over. :(

NoOneNew 6y ago
Okay... how does bitcoin differ from an unstable traditional currency? Both are subject to high and low swings to inflation and deflation. The one thing bitcoin has not been in its history is stable. This still ends up to being the equivalent to "there are 14 standards, let's make a standard to unify them... there are now 15 standards". Plus, all you described was a currency exchange with an extra step. You could replace bitcoin with rice commodity, wheat futures or Tesla stock and achieve the exact same thing. Again, "redistribute to my pocket" with extra steps. Look, I'm not trying to be a dick, but bitcoin was sold on the lie that it helps poor people. You're not wrong for wanting to help poor people. But people need to come to the realization that bitcoin has been Theranos-like the whole time. It's a waste of time if you're goal is to help the poor.
- Torwald 6y ago
  In the discussed scenario, Bitcoin is more secure than a traditional currency. The local regime cannot take your Bitcoins away from you, which it could by hyperinflation, reform etc with the traditional currency. In other words, the trust in the owner of the currency is in fact higher. Local gangsters as well, cannot take your Bitcoins away from you as easily. You have a higher chance at keeping your stash.
  - jacinabox 6y ago
    > Local gangsters as well, cannot take your Bitcoins away from you as easily. You have a higher chance at keeping your stash. I can see what you're doing, you won't get away with this.
- pdpi 6y ago
  Ranging 2015—mid 2017, BTC was slowly going up in price, in a nice steady fashion. It wasn’t until late 2017 that things went completely apeshit. At any rate, the price instability is exactly that — unstable. It’s not systematic hyperflation. For when you don’t have access to conventional forex, it’s better than nothing. > You're not wrong for wanting to help poor people. But people need to come to the realization that bitcoin has been Theranos-like the whole time. It's a waste of time if you're goal is to help the poor. Yeah. That’s a large part of why I used to work at a Bitcoin company.

mywittyname 6y ago

It's useful for moving money from countries with capital restrictions into USA dollars. I know a few people from SEA who use BTC for exactly this purpose.

NoOneNew 6y ago
You do understand the underlying principle as to why cross country capital transfer investigations are done... right? As a hint, look up cocaine cowboys and miami banks (particularly suntrust). While I get it's beneficial for average citizens looking to save a bit on tax/duty fees... it's a lot like wearing a condom when both of you dont care to know each other's name. You have that practice for a reason.
- Torwald 6y ago
  In a country where the local regime is the party engaging in unethical, unlawful conduct, some factors change their algebraic sign.

alwillis 6y ago

Bitcoin is a non-sovereign, hard-capped supply, global, immutable, decentralized digital store of value. It’s an insurance policy against monetary and fiscal policy irresponsibility from central banks and governments globally.