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Duo started with up to 4 participants back in 2019. Facetime is apple only. Zoom is not even end to end encrypted (edit: now), and was built for businesses, a

by ffpip 6y ago

Duo started with up to 4 participants back in 2019. Facetime is apple only. Zoom is not even end to end encrypted (edit: now), and was built for businesses, and apps are close to malware installers

Ansil849 6y ago
> Zoom is not even end to end encrypted https://blog.zoom.us/zoom-rolling-out-end-to-end-encryption-offering/ https://blog.zoom.us/zoom-rolling-out-end-to-end-encryption-...
- ffpip 6y ago
  It's not by default, and still hasn't rolled out here.
  - hiq 6y ago
    And I don't want to diminish the skills of Zoom engineers, but when Google and Facebook (WA) can't offer more than 32 / 8, which tradeoff is Zoom doing to be able to offer E2EE calls with 1000 people? I don't think my phone would be able to receive 1000 different video streams simultaneously for instance.
    - ffpip 6y ago
      If Google offered more with Duo, people would use it for events. Then people wouldn't use Google meet when they go to work. Meet is part of Gsuite.
dastx 6y ago
> apps are close to malware installers I'm probably out of the loop, do you mind expanding on this?
- oarsinsync 6y ago
  First hit on DDG for “Zoom Mac malware”: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-installer-update-privacy-security-concerns https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-instal...
- zaroth 6y ago
  IMO this was part of a misinformation campaign against Zoom from several months back. Zoom is not malware and never was malware, although Zoom did so some installer tricks to help computer illiterate users get into meeting more quickly, which coincidentally is their entire value-add. Note I own no shares in Zoom, do not and never have worked for Zoom, and have no financial interest in Zoom.
  - ffpip 6y ago
    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/apr/02/zoom-technology-security-coronavirus-video-conferencing https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/apr/02/zoom-tech... https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-installer-update-privacy-security-concerns https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-instal... > Zoom is not malware and never was malware I have never said that. I said that installers are close to malware. > which coincidentally is their entire value-add. Yes. This also enabled full camera and mic access without user interaction. Entire value-add. https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/8/20687014/zoom-security-flaw-video-conference-websites-hijack-mac-cameras https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/8/20687014/zoom-security-fla... https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1148393069667991552 https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1148393069667991552
  - akvadrako 6y ago
    That's hogwash – Zoom is more difficult to get working for computer newbies than say Jitsi, which doesn't need any weird installer tricks.
    - BlueTemplar 6y ago
      Depends which Jitsi...

by ffpip 6y ago

Duo started with up to 4 participants back in 2019. Facetime is apple only. Zoom is not even end to end encrypted (edit: now), and was built for businesses, and apps are close to malware installers

Ansil849 6y ago

> Zoom is not even end to end encrypted https://blog.zoom.us/zoom-rolling-out-end-to-end-encryption-offering/ https://blog.zoom.us/zoom-rolling-out-end-to-end-encryption-...

ffpip 6y ago
It's not by default, and still hasn't rolled out here.
- hiq 6y ago
  And I don't want to diminish the skills of Zoom engineers, but when Google and Facebook (WA) can't offer more than 32 / 8, which tradeoff is Zoom doing to be able to offer E2EE calls with 1000 people? I don't think my phone would be able to receive 1000 different video streams simultaneously for instance.
  - ffpip 6y ago
    If Google offered more with Duo, people would use it for events. Then people wouldn't use Google meet when they go to work. Meet is part of Gsuite.

dastx 6y ago

> apps are close to malware installers I'm probably out of the loop, do you mind expanding on this?

oarsinsync 6y ago
First hit on DDG for “Zoom Mac malware”: https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-installer-update-privacy-security-concerns https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-instal...
zaroth 6y ago
IMO this was part of a misinformation campaign against Zoom from several months back. Zoom is not malware and never was malware, although Zoom did so some installer tricks to help computer illiterate users get into meeting more quickly, which coincidentally is their entire value-add. Note I own no shares in Zoom, do not and never have worked for Zoom, and have no financial interest in Zoom.
- ffpip 6y ago
  https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/apr/02/zoom-technology-security-coronavirus-video-conferencing https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/apr/02/zoom-tech... https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-installer-update-privacy-security-concerns https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/2/21204648/zoom-macos-instal... > Zoom is not malware and never was malware I have never said that. I said that installers are close to malware. > which coincidentally is their entire value-add. Yes. This also enabled full camera and mic access without user interaction. Entire value-add. https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/8/20687014/zoom-security-flaw-video-conference-websites-hijack-mac-cameras https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/8/20687014/zoom-security-fla... https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1148393069667991552 https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1148393069667991552
- akvadrako 6y ago
  That's hogwash – Zoom is more difficult to get working for computer newbies than say Jitsi, which doesn't need any weird installer tricks.
  - BlueTemplar 6y ago
    Depends which Jitsi...