5 ms·

You only needed $30k to survive for five years in Sweden?

Legogris 6y ago
If you're able to score affordable housing (~$300/month is not uncommon for student accommodation and if sharing even $150~200 is not unheard of) it's not that much of a stretch. Also big difference between Stockholm (and to some extent Gothenburg) and the rest of the country in living costs.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
sampo 6y ago
Seems you get $84 per week as an allowance, and can withdraw $210 a week as a loan. These are 2016 numbers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_financial_aid_(Sweden) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_financial_aid_(Sweden) You also get, I think, about $150 a month housing allowance. So on top of your $150 + 4×$84 = ca. $500 monthly income, you only need to take about $800 a month as a loan to survive. (Remember, no tuition fees.)
abdullahkhalids 6y ago
My friend did his Masters from Finland and said his monthly expenses were about 200-300 Euros in his first year. I think he spent a bit more in subsequent years after getting a part-time job. That's 18000+ euros if extended to 5 years. Don't overestimate living expenses in a 500 year old walkable town with a small university in a --socialist democracy-- country that cares about its citizens.
- sampo 6y ago
  > socialist democracy In Nordic countries, we don't really like it when Americans call us socialist democracies. We are market economies like everyone else. Here's a take from the Danish prime minister: https://www.vox.com/2015/10/31/9650030/denmark-prime-minister-bernie-sanders https://www.vox.com/2015/10/31/9650030/denmark-prime-ministe...
  - abdullahkhalids 6y ago
    Sorry. But I am Pakistani. From my perspective, if the government is providing free health coverage, subsidized accommodation to students, free education [0], and good public transit, then it is fulfilling the ideals of socialists. However, the label of the actual system might be different, which is totally fair. [0] I think Finland is now charging a small tuition fee, at least for non-EU students.
    - Mauricebranagh 6y ago
      Its not "free" its free at the point of use, its paid for out of general taxation. Otherwise Bismarck's 19th century Prussia would be socialist
    - rswail 6y ago
      The ideals of socialism are that the means of production are owned by the community. So it owns all industry as well. Communism says that there isn't any individual property. Scandinavian countries have never been socialist.
      - atq2119 6y ago
        The rate of state ownership of capital is fairly high in the Nordics, though. In that sense, they're relatively socialist countries. Maybe they're not "really socialist", but then by that standard, is there a "really capitalist" country? Even the US, which is probably the most capitalist "developed" country, has some state ownership of production.
        approxim8ion 6y ago
        state ownership and community ownership aren't the same thing either, to be fair. But given existing systems it's probably the closest one can get.
    - ImprobableTruth 6y ago
      A lot of these were advocated for and often implemented by (originally) socialist democratic parties so I can see where you're coming from, but I think that a 'real' socialist democracy would be going a good step further.
- rswail 6y ago
  Actually a democratic socialist form of government, not socialist democracy. There's actually a big difference. Democratic socialism is not averse to capitalism and understands that the private sector has a role to play. But it also assumes that government has responsibilities to its citizens that amount to more than a minimal set of rights. Up until Reagan, the US had similar policies, with the one exception of health care.
  - abdullahkhalids 6y ago
    Thanks for the clarification. I should have been more careful about the words I used.
- occamrazor 6y ago
  It’s not a “social democracy” It’s a democratic country, with a market economy, and a social democratic approach to labor relations.
checkyoursudo 6y ago
My family of four spends less than $15K per year for necessities in Sweden (housing, clothes, food, car ins, phone, internet, other utilities), so I can believe that a single student could live for $6000 per year if they have roommates or live in student housing. We live in a very small town and rent a nice house for less than $500/month, so of course your choices will make all the difference. We couldn't do this in Stockholm or Gothenburg, for example.
- rubidium 6y ago
  That’s pretty remarkable... can you give more details on monthly budget: After $500 for rent that’s only $750 left. Food: $500? Cell phone/ internet:$70? Clothing: goodwill? Car insurance: $100? Utilities:?
  - JacobSuperslav 6y ago
    Europe is cheaper than most people think. My family of 3 spends less than 20k/year including renting a house in Spain, 100 meters from the shore
    - checkyoursudo 6y ago
      Ah, yes, I maybe should mention that my house is about 50 m from the Baltic? The view of our bay is a significant benefit. Of course, it's covered with ice for several months of the year, and not everybody likes that. >.<
  - checkyoursudo 6y ago
    I'm really sorry that I don't have accurate numbers at hand, but I can give you some estimates. I will also note that the SEK/USD exchange rate is not quite the same as when it sort of got fixed in my mind. I think of it as about 10:1, but I guess it's really more like 8.3:1, so instead of approx. $15K USD maybe it's more like $18K. Anyway, here are some numbers that I know or can give pretty accurate details for: Rent under 4500 SEK/mo Phone data SEK 400 per 6 mo. -- pay as you go - 20 GB for 6 months and never have had to add more. Wifi at home, on the train, and both in the city center and at the University means I rarely use my own. Phone calls SEK 100 has lasted me god knows how long for minutes. I don't think I add minutes more frequently than every six months or so. Car insurance is something like SEK 2500 or 3000 per year for a <10 year old car. Food ~1500 SEK per week -- we are vegetarian and rarely buy anything fancy; we also grow fruit and veg in the summer; this of course can be quite variable, with some weeks being SEK 1200 and others SEK 2000 or more. Utilities: we have a geo heat pump; we don't pay very much in utilities; we mostly charge our EV at the train station for free. Clothes: H&M primarily, Amazon.de occasionally (I guess we have Amazon.se now too) -- my wife and I don't buy new clothes very often, though my children definitely need new stuff regularly. Still, we don't spend very much on clothes, but I will freely admit that this is the one I don't have as much sense of. So, minus an exact number on utilities and clothes, it looks like a bit more than SEK 10,000 per month. Add some exact amount for utilities and clothing, and I think we are within a $15K-18K range.
nemetroid 6y ago
Their numbers are a bit off the mark. You'd get $45k in loans and $20k in grants over five years, so a total of $65k. But yes, as a student it's completely possible to get by on this amount.
lawn 6y ago
As others said you also get some grants that you don't have to repay. This was also 6 years ago and the numbers have changed a little since then. But otherwise yes. And I didn't live a very frugal life and I didn't have a lot of funds when I started out, just enough for furniture and similar.

If you're able to score affordable housing (~$300/month is not uncommon for student accommodation and if sharing even $150~200 is not unheard of) it's not that much of a stretch. Also big difference between Stockholm (and to some extent Gothenburg) and the rest of the country in living costs.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

sampo 6y ago

Seems you get $84 per week as an allowance, and can withdraw $210 a week as a loan. These are 2016 numbers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_financial_aid_(Sweden) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_financial_aid_(Sweden) You also get, I think, about $150 a month housing allowance. So on top of your $150 + 4×$84 = ca. $500 monthly income, you only need to take about $800 a month as a loan to survive. (Remember, no tuition fees.)

abdullahkhalids 6y ago

My friend did his Masters from Finland and said his monthly expenses were about 200-300 Euros in his first year. I think he spent a bit more in subsequent years after getting a part-time job. That's 18000+ euros if extended to 5 years. Don't overestimate living expenses in a 500 year old walkable town with a small university in a --socialist democracy-- country that cares about its citizens.

sampo 6y ago
> socialist democracy In Nordic countries, we don't really like it when Americans call us socialist democracies. We are market economies like everyone else. Here's a take from the Danish prime minister: https://www.vox.com/2015/10/31/9650030/denmark-prime-minister-bernie-sanders https://www.vox.com/2015/10/31/9650030/denmark-prime-ministe...
- abdullahkhalids 6y ago
  Sorry. But I am Pakistani. From my perspective, if the government is providing free health coverage, subsidized accommodation to students, free education [0], and good public transit, then it is fulfilling the ideals of socialists. However, the label of the actual system might be different, which is totally fair. [0] I think Finland is now charging a small tuition fee, at least for non-EU students.
  - Mauricebranagh 6y ago
    Its not "free" its free at the point of use, its paid for out of general taxation. Otherwise Bismarck's 19th century Prussia would be socialist
  - rswail 6y ago
    The ideals of socialism are that the means of production are owned by the community. So it owns all industry as well. Communism says that there isn't any individual property. Scandinavian countries have never been socialist.
    - atq2119 6y ago
      The rate of state ownership of capital is fairly high in the Nordics, though. In that sense, they're relatively socialist countries. Maybe they're not "really socialist", but then by that standard, is there a "really capitalist" country? Even the US, which is probably the most capitalist "developed" country, has some state ownership of production.
      - approxim8ion 6y ago
        state ownership and community ownership aren't the same thing either, to be fair. But given existing systems it's probably the closest one can get.
  - ImprobableTruth 6y ago
    A lot of these were advocated for and often implemented by (originally) socialist democratic parties so I can see where you're coming from, but I think that a 'real' socialist democracy would be going a good step further.
rswail 6y ago
Actually a democratic socialist form of government, not socialist democracy. There's actually a big difference. Democratic socialism is not averse to capitalism and understands that the private sector has a role to play. But it also assumes that government has responsibilities to its citizens that amount to more than a minimal set of rights. Up until Reagan, the US had similar policies, with the one exception of health care.
- abdullahkhalids 6y ago
  Thanks for the clarification. I should have been more careful about the words I used.
occamrazor 6y ago
It’s not a “social democracy” It’s a democratic country, with a market economy, and a social democratic approach to labor relations.

checkyoursudo 6y ago

My family of four spends less than $15K per year for necessities in Sweden (housing, clothes, food, car ins, phone, internet, other utilities), so I can believe that a single student could live for $6000 per year if they have roommates or live in student housing. We live in a very small town and rent a nice house for less than $500/month, so of course your choices will make all the difference. We couldn't do this in Stockholm or Gothenburg, for example.

rubidium 6y ago
That’s pretty remarkable... can you give more details on monthly budget: After $500 for rent that’s only $750 left. Food: $500? Cell phone/ internet:$70? Clothing: goodwill? Car insurance: $100? Utilities:?
- JacobSuperslav 6y ago
  Europe is cheaper than most people think. My family of 3 spends less than 20k/year including renting a house in Spain, 100 meters from the shore
  - checkyoursudo 6y ago
    Ah, yes, I maybe should mention that my house is about 50 m from the Baltic? The view of our bay is a significant benefit. Of course, it's covered with ice for several months of the year, and not everybody likes that. >.<
- checkyoursudo 6y ago
  I'm really sorry that I don't have accurate numbers at hand, but I can give you some estimates. I will also note that the SEK/USD exchange rate is not quite the same as when it sort of got fixed in my mind. I think of it as about 10:1, but I guess it's really more like 8.3:1, so instead of approx. $15K USD maybe it's more like $18K. Anyway, here are some numbers that I know or can give pretty accurate details for: Rent under 4500 SEK/mo Phone data SEK 400 per 6 mo. -- pay as you go - 20 GB for 6 months and never have had to add more. Wifi at home, on the train, and both in the city center and at the University means I rarely use my own. Phone calls SEK 100 has lasted me god knows how long for minutes. I don't think I add minutes more frequently than every six months or so. Car insurance is something like SEK 2500 or 3000 per year for a <10 year old car. Food ~1500 SEK per week -- we are vegetarian and rarely buy anything fancy; we also grow fruit and veg in the summer; this of course can be quite variable, with some weeks being SEK 1200 and others SEK 2000 or more. Utilities: we have a geo heat pump; we don't pay very much in utilities; we mostly charge our EV at the train station for free. Clothes: H&M primarily, Amazon.de occasionally (I guess we have Amazon.se now too) -- my wife and I don't buy new clothes very often, though my children definitely need new stuff regularly. Still, we don't spend very much on clothes, but I will freely admit that this is the one I don't have as much sense of. So, minus an exact number on utilities and clothes, it looks like a bit more than SEK 10,000 per month. Add some exact amount for utilities and clothing, and I think we are within a $15K-18K range.

nemetroid 6y ago

Their numbers are a bit off the mark. You'd get $45k in loans and $20k in grants over five years, so a total of $65k. But yes, as a student it's completely possible to get by on this amount.

lawn 6y ago

As others said you also get some grants that you don't have to repay. This was also 6 years ago and the numbers have changed a little since then. But otherwise yes. And I didn't live a very frugal life and I didn't have a lot of funds when I started out, just enough for furniture and similar.