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>a notification daemon that creates a notification bubble at some part of the screen The DE comes with one, you just send your notification to it. Apps creatin

>a notification daemon that creates a notification bubble at some part of the screen The DE comes with one, you just send your notification to it. Apps creating their own notification bubbles is an anti feature and should be prevented if possible. They don't show in the notification box/ on the lock screen and ignore your do not disturb setting. >a toolbar of some sorts that sits at a specific place on the screen and is summoned on command Put the toolbar inside the app window or make it a new window and let the user decide where it goes. Apps being able to draw over the screen should probably be provided as a root feature as it is pretty dangerous left exposed. >a collapsible terminal application that summons itself on a certain global hotkey and otherwise lays hidden I just checked and gnome allows launching programs via shortcuts. An app should not be able to passively sit in the background collecting keystrokes to launch itself. This is a massive security risk >a program that rearranges other windows for any particular purpose such as tiling them in a specific way that the user wants The window manager implements wayland and is free to arrange windows however it wants as it is a trusted component. Basically all of the stuff in your comment is achievable via the DE/WM. Its a good thing that programs no longer have free reign to do whatever they want and passively record the users keyboard, screen and draw over anything.

Blikkentrekker 6y ago
> The DE comes with one, you just send your notification to it. Apps creating their own notification bubbles is an anti feature and should be prevented if possible. They don't show in the notification box/ on the lock screen and ignore your do not disturb setting. And what if you don't like the one the compositor comes with and want to use a different one? Pantheon, XFCE, Mate and many other systems by design run their notification daemon as a separate process that can be disabled so that the user may choose what he wishes; there are also many standalone notification daemons to fill this gap. > Put the toolbar inside the app window or make it a new window and let the user decide where it goes. Apps being able to draw over the screen should probably be provided as a root feature as it is pretty dangerous left exposed. I mean a global toolbar at the bottom or top of the screen. > I just checked and gnome allows launching programs via shortcuts. An app should not be able to passively sit in the background collecting keystrokes to launch itself. This is a massive security risk It's a “security risk” of a far lesser magnitude than “an application can read and write all data owned by your user”. It's silly to remove features because processes that run with your user's rights have the ability to fuck you up. Might we remove the rm utility now because it's a security risk that it can unlink files? > The window manager implements wayland and is free to arrange windows however it wants as it is a trusted component. And what if it not do so as the user wishes to and the user wishes to use something else to do it? This is why X11 eventually evolved the EWMH standard to allow the window manager and a third program to coöperate without conflict on this. > Basically all of the stuff in your comment is achievable via the DE/WM. Its a good thing that programs no longer have free reign to do whatever they want and passively record the users keyboard, screen and draw over anything. Everything is achievable if it be built in to the compositor including fully fledged video games and web browsers. The reason we have such a thing as software is because the compositor won't have all those things we want, and if it did for every single user, then it would be so bloated beyond belief. The Wayland solution to missing features is “the compositor should do it”, but no compositor has all these features; that is why software exists, and that is why one often writes one's own software.
- kaba0 6y ago
  Or see my previous answer: write a custom extension for your compositor (which in most cases already exists and cross-DE) and add additional feature? Like, notification daemons like this already exist on sway (and every other compositor that use wlroots, a compositor backend).
  - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
    And then they only work on wlroots rather than every Wayland compositor, and then we're back at the original part of the problem that wlroots now had to reimplement the parts of X11 that were deemed safe to remove, but were later found to be used enough to be required. The difference is that on X11 since it's part of the standard it will work everywhere, rather than only with one window manager.

Blikkentrekker 6y ago

> The DE comes with one, you just send your notification to it. Apps creating their own notification bubbles is an anti feature and should be prevented if possible. They don't show in the notification box/ on the lock screen and ignore your do not disturb setting. And what if you don't like the one the compositor comes with and want to use a different one? Pantheon, XFCE, Mate and many other systems by design run their notification daemon as a separate process that can be disabled so that the user may choose what he wishes; there are also many standalone notification daemons to fill this gap. > Put the toolbar inside the app window or make it a new window and let the user decide where it goes. Apps being able to draw over the screen should probably be provided as a root feature as it is pretty dangerous left exposed. I mean a global toolbar at the bottom or top of the screen. > I just checked and gnome allows launching programs via shortcuts. An app should not be able to passively sit in the background collecting keystrokes to launch itself. This is a massive security risk It's a “security risk” of a far lesser magnitude than “an application can read and write all data owned by your user”. It's silly to remove features because processes that run with your user's rights have the ability to fuck you up. Might we remove the rm utility now because it's a security risk that it can unlink files? > The window manager implements wayland and is free to arrange windows however it wants as it is a trusted component. And what if it not do so as the user wishes to and the user wishes to use something else to do it? This is why X11 eventually evolved the EWMH standard to allow the window manager and a third program to coöperate without conflict on this. > Basically all of the stuff in your comment is achievable via the DE/WM. Its a good thing that programs no longer have free reign to do whatever they want and passively record the users keyboard, screen and draw over anything. Everything is achievable if it be built in to the compositor including fully fledged video games and web browsers. The reason we have such a thing as software is because the compositor won't have all those things we want, and if it did for every single user, then it would be so bloated beyond belief. The Wayland solution to missing features is “the compositor should do it”, but no compositor has all these features; that is why software exists, and that is why one often writes one's own software.

kaba0 6y ago
Or see my previous answer: write a custom extension for your compositor (which in most cases already exists and cross-DE) and add additional feature? Like, notification daemons like this already exist on sway (and every other compositor that use wlroots, a compositor backend).
- Blikkentrekker 6y ago
  And then they only work on wlroots rather than every Wayland compositor, and then we're back at the original part of the problem that wlroots now had to reimplement the parts of X11 that were deemed safe to remove, but were later found to be used enough to be required. The difference is that on X11 since it's part of the standard it will work everywhere, rather than only with one window manager.