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Everything about road design is for cars. I've lived in a place with dedicated bike infrastructure. It was amazing. We should be pushing for that. And why are

by tomc1985 6y ago

Everything about road design is for cars. I've lived in a place with dedicated bike infrastructure. It was amazing. We should be pushing for that. And why are cyclists so antagonistic? Not a good look if one wants their group to be taken seriously.

matsemann 6y ago
As if the drivers are cool and level headed while mowing cyclists down? People fearing for their lives are allowed to be agitated. And if you don't want to take a diverse group of people seriously because of some slight you have with a minority of them, you're not really interested in taking them seriously in the first place, and are just looking for excuses. Classic tactic used to neglect lots of groups one's not in. "If the millions of BLM supporters want to be taken seriously, they shouldn't have a few people among them rioting!" is another example.
- tomc1985 6y ago
  See this is what I mean by antagonism. Before roads were for cars they were for horse+buggies, or chariots, or other transport. Cyclists are not first-class citizens on roads and they never will be. And frankly I don't want to get stuck behind one on a road with a dramatically higher speed limit than what you can pedal at. That shit is just rude. The amount of entitlement that seems to come from the cycling community makes it really hard for others to empathize with your situation. You can make a bad faith argument comparing yourselves to BLMers if you want, but I can see right through it. Appreciate your sitaution as a minority among minorities and plan your moves appropriately. But thinking that cyclists should get higher priority over multi-ton cars and such you are mistaken. > People fearing for their lives are allowed to be agitated. Don't forget that by cycling you are choosing to bring a knife to a gunfight.
  - matsemann 6y ago
    > And frankly I don't want to get stuck behind one on a road with a dramatically higher speed limit than what you can pedal at. In big cities that's never a problem. Cars are stuck behind other cars. > You can make a bad faith argument comparing I didn't compare myself to that, only an example. If anything that's a straw man and bad faith on you.. > Don't forget that by cycling you are choosing to bring a knife to a gunfight. It's not a fight. But you and other drivers looking at it like that is very telling, heh.

matsemann 6y ago

As if the drivers are cool and level headed while mowing cyclists down? People fearing for their lives are allowed to be agitated. And if you don't want to take a diverse group of people seriously because of some slight you have with a minority of them, you're not really interested in taking them seriously in the first place, and are just looking for excuses. Classic tactic used to neglect lots of groups one's not in. "If the millions of BLM supporters want to be taken seriously, they shouldn't have a few people among them rioting!" is another example.

tomc1985 6y ago
See this is what I mean by antagonism. Before roads were for cars they were for horse+buggies, or chariots, or other transport. Cyclists are not first-class citizens on roads and they never will be. And frankly I don't want to get stuck behind one on a road with a dramatically higher speed limit than what you can pedal at. That shit is just rude. The amount of entitlement that seems to come from the cycling community makes it really hard for others to empathize with your situation. You can make a bad faith argument comparing yourselves to BLMers if you want, but I can see right through it. Appreciate your sitaution as a minority among minorities and plan your moves appropriately. But thinking that cyclists should get higher priority over multi-ton cars and such you are mistaken. > People fearing for their lives are allowed to be agitated. Don't forget that by cycling you are choosing to bring a knife to a gunfight.
- matsemann 6y ago
  > And frankly I don't want to get stuck behind one on a road with a dramatically higher speed limit than what you can pedal at. In big cities that's never a problem. Cars are stuck behind other cars. > You can make a bad faith argument comparing I didn't compare myself to that, only an example. If anything that's a straw man and bad faith on you.. > Don't forget that by cycling you are choosing to bring a knife to a gunfight. It's not a fight. But you and other drivers looking at it like that is very telling, heh.