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Steve Jobs made a similar point a number of times based on his experience as CEO of Pixar: > Hollywood's really different than Silicon Valley. And neither unde

Steve Jobs made a similar point a number of times based on his experience as CEO of Pixar: > Hollywood's really different than Silicon Valley. And neither understands the other at all. People up here think being creative is some guys in their late 20s and early 30s sitting around old couches drinking beer thinking up jokes. It couldn't be further from the truth. The creative process is just as disciplined as the technical process; it requires just as much talent. And yet people in Hollywood think technology is only as deep as something you buy. There's no technical culture in Hollywood, they couldn't attract and retain good engineers to save their life, because they're second class citizens down there. Just like creative people are second class citizens in Silicon Valley. http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,32207-6,00.html http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,32207-6...

toyg 6y ago
I don't often agree with a Jobs quote, but when I do... My experience as a geek, on shores very far from Silicon Valley, is that engineers are second-class citizens almost everywhere, but particularly where "creatives" are on top.
- fakedang 6y ago
  Both actually kneel to marketers and sales tbh. Look at any high paying industry/job, apart from FAANG tech or doctors - it's either marketing or sales at the end of the day. I'll go so far as to say that even most doctors in the US are in the sales business.
  - xwdv 6y ago
    100%. Engineers and creatives rarely contribute directly to revenue the way marketing and sales does.
    - fakedang 6y ago
      I kind of didn't want to put the statement out that way actually, although I didn't delve much deeper. There are places where engineers' and creatives' opinions are valued and taken into account when making decisions, for instance certain quant funds or Hollywood studios. If you want to not be considered a second-class citizen, so to speak, work in a place where ideally your job isn't just coding or building content, but also convincing others of your own ideas (sales) and building consensus within the organization to back them (marketing).
- thu2111 6y ago
  I think this is a big part of why there is such a thing as a tech company. If you think about it, it's a weird concept to exist otherwise as basically every company uses technology. But "tech firms" as we know them are really "firms run by geeks". The people who can't get respect unless they create their own companies where they're on top from day one :(

toyg 6y ago

I don't often agree with a Jobs quote, but when I do... My experience as a geek, on shores very far from Silicon Valley, is that engineers are second-class citizens almost everywhere, but particularly where "creatives" are on top.

fakedang 6y ago
Both actually kneel to marketers and sales tbh. Look at any high paying industry/job, apart from FAANG tech or doctors - it's either marketing or sales at the end of the day. I'll go so far as to say that even most doctors in the US are in the sales business.
- xwdv 6y ago
  100%. Engineers and creatives rarely contribute directly to revenue the way marketing and sales does.
  - fakedang 6y ago
    I kind of didn't want to put the statement out that way actually, although I didn't delve much deeper. There are places where engineers' and creatives' opinions are valued and taken into account when making decisions, for instance certain quant funds or Hollywood studios. If you want to not be considered a second-class citizen, so to speak, work in a place where ideally your job isn't just coding or building content, but also convincing others of your own ideas (sales) and building consensus within the organization to back them (marketing).
thu2111 6y ago
I think this is a big part of why there is such a thing as a tech company. If you think about it, it's a weird concept to exist otherwise as basically every company uses technology. But "tech firms" as we know them are really "firms run by geeks". The people who can't get respect unless they create their own companies where they're on top from day one :(