6 ms·

The neat thing is that any foreigner can study any subject at any University in Germany for almost free. The only drawback here is that obviously most classes a

The neat thing is that any foreigner can study any subject at any University in Germany for almost free. The only drawback here is that obviously most classes are in German, so knowledge of the "awful German language" (Mark Twain) is required. https://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/twain.german.html https://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/twain.german.html If you are interested, here is a good starting point: https://www.uni-assist.de/en/ https://www.uni-assist.de/en/ Edit: Changed "free" to "almost free"

Tomte 6y ago
Re: cost at this university: "A complete bachelor's program costs between 1,600 and 2,400 euro, while a master’s program costs between 1,000 and 1,200 euro. These estimates are based on course costs of 20 euro per credit hour, plus a student body contribution of 11 euro per semester."
- eastendguy 6y ago
  That is what I would consider free, or in other words: tuition costs << living costs
  - Tomte 6y ago
    Wasn't meant to be a contradiction, I just found the numbers on the web site and thought I'd throw them in. BTW, I never knew, but they run an efficient operation, it seems. My Alma Mater, the University of Stuttgart, has 23k students, 5.3k staff, including 265 professors. They run on an annual budget of 536 million Euros. (All numbers from Wikipedia) The FernUni has 76k students (3x), 1.3k staff (1/3), including 90 professors (1/3), on an annual budget of 90 million Euros (1/6).
    - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
      I suppose not needing many facilities nor (I think) research output means you gain a lot of efficiency.
    - leipert 6y ago
      I assume that the amount of research that is done, papers produced, etc. is much higher in traditional Unis compared to the Fernuni. If you look it through the reverse lense, the ratio of professor to student is much worse than your alma mater. So one professor has to take care of much more students, exams, etc. To me the Fernuni seems great if you want to study while having a job, during a pandemic, are just interested in the degree, are not a in-Person Person, are a Self-motivating learner or live far away from a Uni City. The traditional Uni seems great, if you want to experience social life, are a study group kind of person, want to go into academia, like noodles for 2€ in the Mensa. Also a lot of STEM or medicine that needs access to research facilities will be easier in a traditional Uni.
foepys 6y ago
> awful German language Ich komm dir gleich rüber! /s Speaking and writing German is a bit complicated but for rudimentary understanding of texts you do not need to know as many words as in English. If you are looking for Computer Science there are many English lectures available.
- philshem 6y ago
  It’s a 19th century essay from Mark Twain about the difficulties learning German as an English speaker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Awful_German_Language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Awful_German_Language The title translated into German is "Die Schrecken der deutschen Sprache" ("The Horrors of the German Language") which is more appropriate.
  - wadkar 6y ago
    Deutsche Sprache, schwere Sprache
    - ben_w 6y ago
      It was surprising to see that phrase in Duolingo, but far more surprising to hear a native German speaker using it in the workplace.
  - aitait 6y ago
    I don't think German is really difficult. Some things are strange for an English speaker: declension, therefore flexible word order and gender is more elusive compared to Spanish. There is a saying: "Hungarian... the only tongue in the world the devil respects."
- uoaei 6y ago
  Specialist vocabulary for specific disciplines is also quite graspable. (Disclaimer: I say this as a physicist, where all the German words for physics concepts are quite straightforward.)
DataDaoDe 6y ago
> The neat thing is that any foreigner can study any subject at any University in Germany for free. This statement is not true. It is the case though that many if not most public German universities have costs that run in the very low thousands i.e. 1-5k for total degree costs. However, there are some drawbacks to the way this system works. For one, you will be hard pressed to find online degree offerings or continuing studies options from public Universities (i.e. these types of low costs offerings) that allow you to continue your education while working fulltime. Most of these come from private institutions or specific programs which have higher costs typically running in the 10k+ cost range area. Its great if you are a student graduating from high school and going to university - you won't be burdened with high costs. However, the public system largely still neglects (this lone University being the only example in all of Germany which I am aware of) many other situations where people might want to further their education. We do have something called Volkshochschulen, which is in some ways similar to Junior Colleges in the United States and provides some level of extended studies at a public level, but anyway, I won't go into details, suffice it to say the systems don't translate one-to-one onto each other and there are cons with our system as well.
- est31 6y ago
  > this lone University being the only example in all of Germany which I am aware of Yes indeed this is the only state run distance-learning university, but I'd argue that you only really need one such institution. After all, you can study from anywhere :). They have regional centers in many German towns, but for most courses you only need to be there for the exams at the end of the semester, so you can also study hours away from the next regional center. And it's quite successful. By number of enrolled students, it's the largest university of Germany at 77k, with the runner up having only 56k students.
  - DataDaoDe 6y ago
    Agreed. Its fantastic we have any such place. However, having had conversations with friends and family outside of Germany, they usually hear the costs and then imagine the system in the USA or their home country just with much lower costs. And this is just not the case. Our German system is a very different system from the USA at all levels which complicates direct comparisons. Regardless, I think initiatives like this one which in general provide more opportunites to more people to better their lives is something I would like to see more of, not just in Germany but all over the world.
ratww 6y ago
The language is pretty great beyond the surface, IMO. Most of the common hurdles (akkusativ/dativ, long words, and also number order) are dealt with in the first months of german learning (A1 level) and are not really an issue in real life. I still might misgender objects from time to time, but it can also happen in the other three romance languages I speak. It's also fun when it happens and the jokes are a good mnemonic device ("the sun is not a boy, how dare you"). Also I agree with foepys that you can do more in German with a smaller vocabulary. Schlag is also used in sports and music :) Plus, people like to downplay it, but most people here do speak english, so if you have difficulty, it's ok to ask in english when you're 1:1.
- looping__lui 6y ago
  I feel that English probably is the most effective language for anything science/engineering/business related. It’s so much easier to express yourself in good and convincing and clear ways (plus as the lingua franca in many of those domains, there isn’t necessarily a great German translation). So I actually prefer having any conversations in these fields in English, even w/ German colleagues. In Law though, nothing seems to beat the preciseness of the German language. It’s very good in expressing exactly what the relationships and rules should be. Some people love it from the “literalistic” point of view - but I just like the efficiency of the English language and the distinctive humor that a lot of english speaking authors put in their writings; so I can’t speak to that. The German language feels to me like it wasn’t made for science, engineering or fun but rather law and bureaucracy. Just my personal two cents.
  - Tomte 6y ago
    German was not quite the lingua franca of mathematics, but something many mathematicians learned at least to some degree, before the World Wars. That's why so many German words have survived there (take eigen vector, for example). Also Western philosophy had a slightly German-language bend. I doubt there is a substantial body of science that can be expressed much better in English. It's probably a wash, with some words and concepts easier to express in this, and some in that.

Tomte 6y ago

Re: cost at this university: "A complete bachelor's program costs between 1,600 and 2,400 euro, while a master’s program costs between 1,000 and 1,200 euro. These estimates are based on course costs of 20 euro per credit hour, plus a student body contribution of 11 euro per semester."

eastendguy 6y ago
That is what I would consider free, or in other words: tuition costs << living costs
- Tomte 6y ago
  Wasn't meant to be a contradiction, I just found the numbers on the web site and thought I'd throw them in. BTW, I never knew, but they run an efficient operation, it seems. My Alma Mater, the University of Stuttgart, has 23k students, 5.3k staff, including 265 professors. They run on an annual budget of 536 million Euros. (All numbers from Wikipedia) The FernUni has 76k students (3x), 1.3k staff (1/3), including 90 professors (1/3), on an annual budget of 90 million Euros (1/6).
  - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
    I suppose not needing many facilities nor (I think) research output means you gain a lot of efficiency.
  - leipert 6y ago
    I assume that the amount of research that is done, papers produced, etc. is much higher in traditional Unis compared to the Fernuni. If you look it through the reverse lense, the ratio of professor to student is much worse than your alma mater. So one professor has to take care of much more students, exams, etc. To me the Fernuni seems great if you want to study while having a job, during a pandemic, are just interested in the degree, are not a in-Person Person, are a Self-motivating learner or live far away from a Uni City. The traditional Uni seems great, if you want to experience social life, are a study group kind of person, want to go into academia, like noodles for 2€ in the Mensa. Also a lot of STEM or medicine that needs access to research facilities will be easier in a traditional Uni.

foepys 6y ago

> awful German language Ich komm dir gleich rüber! /s Speaking and writing German is a bit complicated but for rudimentary understanding of texts you do not need to know as many words as in English. If you are looking for Computer Science there are many English lectures available.

philshem 6y ago
It’s a 19th century essay from Mark Twain about the difficulties learning German as an English speaker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Awful_German_Language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Awful_German_Language The title translated into German is "Die Schrecken der deutschen Sprache" ("The Horrors of the German Language") which is more appropriate.
- wadkar 6y ago
  Deutsche Sprache, schwere Sprache
  - ben_w 6y ago
    It was surprising to see that phrase in Duolingo, but far more surprising to hear a native German speaker using it in the workplace.
- aitait 6y ago
  I don't think German is really difficult. Some things are strange for an English speaker: declension, therefore flexible word order and gender is more elusive compared to Spanish. There is a saying: "Hungarian... the only tongue in the world the devil respects."
uoaei 6y ago
Specialist vocabulary for specific disciplines is also quite graspable. (Disclaimer: I say this as a physicist, where all the German words for physics concepts are quite straightforward.)

DataDaoDe 6y ago

> The neat thing is that any foreigner can study any subject at any University in Germany for free. This statement is not true. It is the case though that many if not most public German universities have costs that run in the very low thousands i.e. 1-5k for total degree costs. However, there are some drawbacks to the way this system works. For one, you will be hard pressed to find online degree offerings or continuing studies options from public Universities (i.e. these types of low costs offerings) that allow you to continue your education while working fulltime. Most of these come from private institutions or specific programs which have higher costs typically running in the 10k+ cost range area. Its great if you are a student graduating from high school and going to university - you won't be burdened with high costs. However, the public system largely still neglects (this lone University being the only example in all of Germany which I am aware of) many other situations where people might want to further their education. We do have something called Volkshochschulen, which is in some ways similar to Junior Colleges in the United States and provides some level of extended studies at a public level, but anyway, I won't go into details, suffice it to say the systems don't translate one-to-one onto each other and there are cons with our system as well.

est31 6y ago
> this lone University being the only example in all of Germany which I am aware of Yes indeed this is the only state run distance-learning university, but I'd argue that you only really need one such institution. After all, you can study from anywhere :). They have regional centers in many German towns, but for most courses you only need to be there for the exams at the end of the semester, so you can also study hours away from the next regional center. And it's quite successful. By number of enrolled students, it's the largest university of Germany at 77k, with the runner up having only 56k students.
- DataDaoDe 6y ago
  Agreed. Its fantastic we have any such place. However, having had conversations with friends and family outside of Germany, they usually hear the costs and then imagine the system in the USA or their home country just with much lower costs. And this is just not the case. Our German system is a very different system from the USA at all levels which complicates direct comparisons. Regardless, I think initiatives like this one which in general provide more opportunites to more people to better their lives is something I would like to see more of, not just in Germany but all over the world.

ratww 6y ago

The language is pretty great beyond the surface, IMO. Most of the common hurdles (akkusativ/dativ, long words, and also number order) are dealt with in the first months of german learning (A1 level) and are not really an issue in real life. I still might misgender objects from time to time, but it can also happen in the other three romance languages I speak. It's also fun when it happens and the jokes are a good mnemonic device ("the sun is not a boy, how dare you"). Also I agree with foepys that you can do more in German with a smaller vocabulary. Schlag is also used in sports and music :) Plus, people like to downplay it, but most people here do speak english, so if you have difficulty, it's ok to ask in english when you're 1:1.

looping__lui 6y ago
I feel that English probably is the most effective language for anything science/engineering/business related. It’s so much easier to express yourself in good and convincing and clear ways (plus as the lingua franca in many of those domains, there isn’t necessarily a great German translation). So I actually prefer having any conversations in these fields in English, even w/ German colleagues. In Law though, nothing seems to beat the preciseness of the German language. It’s very good in expressing exactly what the relationships and rules should be. Some people love it from the “literalistic” point of view - but I just like the efficiency of the English language and the distinctive humor that a lot of english speaking authors put in their writings; so I can’t speak to that. The German language feels to me like it wasn’t made for science, engineering or fun but rather law and bureaucracy. Just my personal two cents.
- Tomte 6y ago
  German was not quite the lingua franca of mathematics, but something many mathematicians learned at least to some degree, before the World Wars. That's why so many German words have survived there (take eigen vector, for example). Also Western philosophy had a slightly German-language bend. I doubt there is a substantial body of science that can be expressed much better in English. It's probably a wash, with some words and concepts easier to express in this, and some in that.