4 ms·

I know just enough to be dangerous :) I actually have an autoimmune disease, so that's the reason for my question, specifically wondering about the chance for

I know just enough to be dangerous :) I actually have an autoimmune disease, so that's the reason for my question, specifically wondering about the chance for an MRNA vaccine triggering or deepening autoimmune disease. So if I understand you correctly, the self-recognition system is something built-in and doesn't change in response to foreign antigens? Or in other words, it's only the recognition of foreign molecules that will change, but this shouldn't affect the production (or culling) of T-cells that are super-sensitive to host's own self-antigens? PS. And thank you and thanks to others for answering newbie questions on this thread! :)

sgfyd 6y ago
> specifically wondering about the chance for an MRNA vaccine triggering or deepening autoimmune disease. I think the medical guidance has been pretty clear that you should not get the vaccine in this case. There are a lot of people who care more about their own safety than yours who may try to change your mind. Don't listen to them; don't get your medical advice on the internet. Find an expert.
- rolph 6y ago
  i have a friend that is quite allergic to aluminum, and zinc on contact. these sort of allergies are about hypersensativity, it sounds like you may have problems with any sort of foriegn challenge to your body. A major component of most vaccines is an adjuvent and that is intended to make your immune system extremely ready to recognize foriegn antigens. this means a very good chance you will have a flare up. you want to have sound medical advice from a doctor regarding your own health characteristics. Bare minimum i would want to see direct supervision and observation after a vaccine.
  - sgfyd 6y ago
    Allergic reactions to adjuvants is an entirely different matter (than autoimmune reactions) and may actually not apply to these vaccines. This just goes to show, don't get your medical advice from HN.
    - rolph 6y ago
      hypersensativity is an autoimmune disorder, and by the way the use of aluminum salts as adjuvent is being phased out, there is great opportunity to formulate the liposomasal delivery vesicle to mimick a pathogenic cell wall.
rolph 6y ago
yes you have the concept. the molecular level of the mechanism, beyond the cellular level is detail that needs to be elucidated.
nicwilson 6y ago
Without knowing which auto-immune disease its hard to give more information (which is fine, this is not medical advice). > So if I understand you correctly, the self-recognition system is something built-in Yes. before immune cells are released and "primed" they go through a selection process where the receptors they have for (unknown) antigens are tested against a vast array of proteins the body normally produces, if they bind, they are killed off. Sometimes this doesn't work and if they are activated and bind their (self-)antigen when the immune system is activated (i.e. during an infection) they can attack uninfected cells. Which as a one off event is not problematic, the problem comes from the fact that those immune cells stick around when they contact their antigen, and if it is produced by the body this is a lot, and continue to kill healthy cells and cause inflammation. > and doesn't change in response to foreign antigens? By the time the immune cells bind to foreign agents they have already gone through the selection process. Necessarily a vaccine will produce an immune response (or otherwise it won't have the intended effect), this could cause an autoimmune response because the atuoresponsive cells, presumably, have their antigen around. > but this shouldn't affect the production (or culling) of T-cells that are super-sensitive to host's own self-antigens? new ones, no. In fact if you're not a child, you aren't producing many new (unique) T-cells at all. Old ones however may proliferate if their antigen is present and an immune response is triggered (to the vaccine or the virus). If you want real advice, don't take it from some random on the internet with only a minor in biomed, talk to your doctor or immunologist.

sgfyd 6y ago

> specifically wondering about the chance for an MRNA vaccine triggering or deepening autoimmune disease. I think the medical guidance has been pretty clear that you should not get the vaccine in this case. There are a lot of people who care more about their own safety than yours who may try to change your mind. Don't listen to them; don't get your medical advice on the internet. Find an expert.

rolph 6y ago
i have a friend that is quite allergic to aluminum, and zinc on contact. these sort of allergies are about hypersensativity, it sounds like you may have problems with any sort of foriegn challenge to your body. A major component of most vaccines is an adjuvent and that is intended to make your immune system extremely ready to recognize foriegn antigens. this means a very good chance you will have a flare up. you want to have sound medical advice from a doctor regarding your own health characteristics. Bare minimum i would want to see direct supervision and observation after a vaccine.
- sgfyd 6y ago
  Allergic reactions to adjuvants is an entirely different matter (than autoimmune reactions) and may actually not apply to these vaccines. This just goes to show, don't get your medical advice from HN.
  - rolph 6y ago
    hypersensativity is an autoimmune disorder, and by the way the use of aluminum salts as adjuvent is being phased out, there is great opportunity to formulate the liposomasal delivery vesicle to mimick a pathogenic cell wall.

rolph 6y ago

yes you have the concept. the molecular level of the mechanism, beyond the cellular level is detail that needs to be elucidated.

nicwilson 6y ago

Without knowing which auto-immune disease its hard to give more information (which is fine, this is not medical advice). > So if I understand you correctly, the self-recognition system is something built-in Yes. before immune cells are released and "primed" they go through a selection process where the receptors they have for (unknown) antigens are tested against a vast array of proteins the body normally produces, if they bind, they are killed off. Sometimes this doesn't work and if they are activated and bind their (self-)antigen when the immune system is activated (i.e. during an infection) they can attack uninfected cells. Which as a one off event is not problematic, the problem comes from the fact that those immune cells stick around when they contact their antigen, and if it is produced by the body this is a lot, and continue to kill healthy cells and cause inflammation. > and doesn't change in response to foreign antigens? By the time the immune cells bind to foreign agents they have already gone through the selection process. Necessarily a vaccine will produce an immune response (or otherwise it won't have the intended effect), this could cause an autoimmune response because the atuoresponsive cells, presumably, have their antigen around. > but this shouldn't affect the production (or culling) of T-cells that are super-sensitive to host's own self-antigens? new ones, no. In fact if you're not a child, you aren't producing many new (unique) T-cells at all. Old ones however may proliferate if their antigen is present and an immune response is triggered (to the vaccine or the virus). If you want real advice, don't take it from some random on the internet with only a minor in biomed, talk to your doctor or immunologist.