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Gebru [did something Google didn't like] and was terminated immediately. You got that part right. Unless I'm missing something it hardly seems outrageous. Wh

by vanusa 6y ago

Gebru [did something Google didn't like] and was terminated immediately. You got that part right. Unless I'm missing something it hardly seems outrageous. What you're missing is the central point of contention here: that Google is claiming she "resigned" when quite plainly she was terminated. Along with the secondary point that Sundar is now trying to make it sort of look like he understands what went wrong and it apologizing for it. Except he doesn't and he isn't, really. Gebru wrote an email to a wide audience with a series of unprofessional complaints Would you care to enumerate what these were, specifically?

ALittleLight 6y ago
The difference between resigned and fired doesn't seem that meaningful to me. Is there an agreed on definition of the terms? As I understand it Gebru said something like I need X, Y, and Z or I can work on an end date. Google then "accepted her resignation" or fired her. However you prefer to say it. I can see that mattering if she needs to collect unemployment or something, but then it seems like a legal discussion which I'm not equipped for. In the vernacular, it seems like she threatened to resign and Google accepted it. Either way, I don't see why a vocabulary dispute is a big deal. Regarding her unprofessional email, it might be easiest to read it for yourself. https://www.platformer.news/p/the-withering-email-that-got-an-ethical https://www.platformer.news/p/the-withering-email-that-got-a... Finally, regarding Pichai's comments, I've not read them so I don't know what he did or didn't say. You seem to be assuming he should apologize and complaining that he didn't though. I'd start by asking why he should apologize? I'm not really convinced Google did anything wrong here.
- vanusa 6y ago
  The difference between resigned and fired doesn't seem that meaningful to me. I don't see how one can say this. There's a huge, intrinsic difference between the two. Is there an agreed on definition of the terms? When you set the date - it's a resignation. When they set the date - it's a termination. When a company says it was the former when it was really the latter (and pretty much obviously so) - they're playing with your head.
  - ALittleLight 6y ago
    My colloquial understanding is that resign is when you end it and fired is when they do. In this situation it seems half and half, which may be why the difference between the terms doesn't matter to much to me. Using your definition, yes, it seems clear this was a firing, but again, so what? Does a disagreement on terms really necessitate the drama (news articles, petition, protests)? If she was being denied money somehow because of the distinction then I could see it being a legal case, but I haven't heard anything like that. Google said she resigned, she said she didn't, okay. If anything, saying she resigned sounds a bit nicer to me than saying she was fired. Probably best if Google had not commented on it at all.

by vanusa 6y ago

ALittleLight 6y ago

The difference between resigned and fired doesn't seem that meaningful to me. Is there an agreed on definition of the terms? As I understand it Gebru said something like I need X, Y, and Z or I can work on an end date. Google then "accepted her resignation" or fired her. However you prefer to say it. I can see that mattering if she needs to collect unemployment or something, but then it seems like a legal discussion which I'm not equipped for. In the vernacular, it seems like she threatened to resign and Google accepted it. Either way, I don't see why a vocabulary dispute is a big deal. Regarding her unprofessional email, it might be easiest to read it for yourself. https://www.platformer.news/p/the-withering-email-that-got-an-ethical https://www.platformer.news/p/the-withering-email-that-got-a... Finally, regarding Pichai's comments, I've not read them so I don't know what he did or didn't say. You seem to be assuming he should apologize and complaining that he didn't though. I'd start by asking why he should apologize? I'm not really convinced Google did anything wrong here.

vanusa 6y ago
The difference between resigned and fired doesn't seem that meaningful to me. I don't see how one can say this. There's a huge, intrinsic difference between the two. Is there an agreed on definition of the terms? When you set the date - it's a resignation. When they set the date - it's a termination. When a company says it was the former when it was really the latter (and pretty much obviously so) - they're playing with your head.
- ALittleLight 6y ago
  My colloquial understanding is that resign is when you end it and fired is when they do. In this situation it seems half and half, which may be why the difference between the terms doesn't matter to much to me. Using your definition, yes, it seems clear this was a firing, but again, so what? Does a disagreement on terms really necessitate the drama (news articles, petition, protests)? If she was being denied money somehow because of the distinction then I could see it being a legal case, but I haven't heard anything like that. Google said she resigned, she said she didn't, okay. If anything, saying she resigned sounds a bit nicer to me than saying she was fired. Probably best if Google had not commented on it at all.