4 ms·

I just hope the older generations who adamantly and mindlessly insisted that "all drugs are bad" live long enough to feel the deep shame they deserve for causin

I just hope the older generations who adamantly and mindlessly insisted that "all drugs are bad" live long enough to feel the deep shame they deserve for causing so much harm and preventing so much joy and much-needed help to so many millions and millions of people.

marpstar 6y ago
But what information was accessible to them to change their mind? They wouldn't have seen headlines like this unless their local newspaper chose to run the article. They wouldn't have been able to go searching for this information without going to a library. I'm not defending their stance, but I think it's easy to forget that we have a lot more information thrown at us in a given day than they probably had in a decade.
- standardUser 6y ago
  True, but we are not talking about 100% of the over 60 crowd. We're talking about maybe 65% give or take. There were opportunities for people to expand their perspectives. Many took those opportunities, most did not, and as the evidence mounted over the decades, the rate at which those generations shifted their opinions was embarrassingly slow (and came at a tremendous cost of human suffering, while conferring them no benefit).
- foxtr0t 6y ago
  There was a lot of scientific information about psychedelics from the 50s and 60s. Illegalization and stigmatization of psychedelics was largely political and antagonistic towards the scientific community that was doing actual research. Also anyone curious enough to try out psychedelics will realize they're very different from narcotics. In the US there was always a subculture that accepted use of psychedelics, information passing through books, writings, unofficial journals etc. So to say the information wasn't accessible just isn't true. It may have been hidden, but if it was it was in plain sight and to anyone curious this world was easily accessible and accepting.
carapace 6y ago
Your vindictiveness harshes my mellow. Forgive them. The magic isn't in the mushroom, it's in the love, compassion, forgiveness, and gratitude that [can] emerge naturally when the mushroom god addles your brain chemistry.
- standardUser 6y ago
  I'll forgive them when the loudly embrace the decriminalization of all drugs. Their cowardly baby steps continue to cause suffering every single day.
- foxtr0t 6y ago
  Yes yes, wishing shame on another is beyond the pale. Seriously, wishing someone feels regret, shame, embarrassment isn't incompatible with forgiveness. Learning difficult lessons, especially from harmful mistakes, is the only way society makes progress.
  - bigbubba 6y ago
    You can't deny there is a certain vindictiveness to that comment. Being a little vindictive is fine, it's unreasonable to expect saintly purity from people, but it's good to admit such mindsets to yourself at least.
    - standardUser 6y ago
      I'll point you to my follow-up comment. These same people continue to support the direct pain and suffering of millions of other people by their insistence on taking only the smallest steps towards an evidence-oriented approach to drug laws. I'll forgive those who repent, the rest I'll leave to Jesus.
      - bigbubba 6y ago
        That's a justification for your vindictiveness (which I did not ask nor expect you to justify.) I am suggesting that you recognize your vindictiveness for what it is, not that you deny yourself feelings of vindictiveness.
pmoriarty 6y ago
There's a lot of ignorance about drugs among the general public, and they tended to buy in to the anti-drug propaganda coming at them from all sides -- from the media, from anti-drug scientists, from the DEA and various anti-drug organizations, and from society at large. It's hard to blame them, when they're surrounded by such propaganda, and (as usual) very few people were independent enough to actually dig deep in to this themselves and find out what was really going on in respect to drug safety, benefits, and policy. Most just swallowed the official line.
- dfxm12 6y ago
  Most just swallowed the official line. I know we're largely talking about hypothetical people, but if people were just going with the flow, I'm not sure that explains the inability to swallow the new official line.
  - pmoriarty 6y ago
    "I'm not sure that explains the inability to swallow the new official line." How official is it? In the US, at least, the government spent many millions of dollars (hundreds of millions? billions?) on anti-drug education campaigns for decades, and there was mass media hysteria against drugs for decades. There are still no comparable pro-drug education campaigns, and while there have been some positive research results and positive media coverage on some drugs, the message overall is pretty mixed, and there's still plenty of anti-drug hysteria in the media and anti-drug messages from the government today. It's probably going to take a long time to change the minds of most people who grew up soaked in anti-drug propaganda.
nineplay 6y ago
Older generations? I hope you aren't talking about the baby boomers who practically created drug culture. "all drugs are bad" was a "greatest generation" attitude and I'm afraid they are mostly beyond caring
- standardUser 6y ago
  Sure, a sliver of the Baby Boomer generation has been given vastly too much attention for doing some drugs. Meanwhile, the bulk of that generation are responsible for the largest per capita prison population in the developed world and the ruin of millions of young lives.
eshack94 6y ago
Why do you wish shame on others? We should forgive others if possible.
- standardUser 6y ago
  Let's start by forgiving every non-violent drug offender rotting in prisons throughout the US. Then we can forgive those who put them there.
hn_asker 6y ago
The older generations definitely helped Big Pharma. I just hope these new treatments free us from the antipsychotic/antidepressant pseudoscience.
dang 6y ago
I'm late to this comment but please do not post unsubstantive flamebait like this, and especially not generational flamewar, which is one of the last things we need here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

marpstar 6y ago

But what information was accessible to them to change their mind? They wouldn't have seen headlines like this unless their local newspaper chose to run the article. They wouldn't have been able to go searching for this information without going to a library. I'm not defending their stance, but I think it's easy to forget that we have a lot more information thrown at us in a given day than they probably had in a decade.

standardUser 6y ago
True, but we are not talking about 100% of the over 60 crowd. We're talking about maybe 65% give or take. There were opportunities for people to expand their perspectives. Many took those opportunities, most did not, and as the evidence mounted over the decades, the rate at which those generations shifted their opinions was embarrassingly slow (and came at a tremendous cost of human suffering, while conferring them no benefit).
foxtr0t 6y ago
There was a lot of scientific information about psychedelics from the 50s and 60s. Illegalization and stigmatization of psychedelics was largely political and antagonistic towards the scientific community that was doing actual research. Also anyone curious enough to try out psychedelics will realize they're very different from narcotics. In the US there was always a subculture that accepted use of psychedelics, information passing through books, writings, unofficial journals etc. So to say the information wasn't accessible just isn't true. It may have been hidden, but if it was it was in plain sight and to anyone curious this world was easily accessible and accepting.

carapace 6y ago

Your vindictiveness harshes my mellow. Forgive them. The magic isn't in the mushroom, it's in the love, compassion, forgiveness, and gratitude that [can] emerge naturally when the mushroom god addles your brain chemistry.

standardUser 6y ago
I'll forgive them when the loudly embrace the decriminalization of all drugs. Their cowardly baby steps continue to cause suffering every single day.
foxtr0t 6y ago
Yes yes, wishing shame on another is beyond the pale. Seriously, wishing someone feels regret, shame, embarrassment isn't incompatible with forgiveness. Learning difficult lessons, especially from harmful mistakes, is the only way society makes progress.
- bigbubba 6y ago
  You can't deny there is a certain vindictiveness to that comment. Being a little vindictive is fine, it's unreasonable to expect saintly purity from people, but it's good to admit such mindsets to yourself at least.
  - standardUser 6y ago
    I'll point you to my follow-up comment. These same people continue to support the direct pain and suffering of millions of other people by their insistence on taking only the smallest steps towards an evidence-oriented approach to drug laws. I'll forgive those who repent, the rest I'll leave to Jesus.
    - bigbubba 6y ago
      That's a justification for your vindictiveness (which I did not ask nor expect you to justify.) I am suggesting that you recognize your vindictiveness for what it is, not that you deny yourself feelings of vindictiveness.

pmoriarty 6y ago

There's a lot of ignorance about drugs among the general public, and they tended to buy in to the anti-drug propaganda coming at them from all sides -- from the media, from anti-drug scientists, from the DEA and various anti-drug organizations, and from society at large. It's hard to blame them, when they're surrounded by such propaganda, and (as usual) very few people were independent enough to actually dig deep in to this themselves and find out what was really going on in respect to drug safety, benefits, and policy. Most just swallowed the official line.

dfxm12 6y ago
Most just swallowed the official line. I know we're largely talking about hypothetical people, but if people were just going with the flow, I'm not sure that explains the inability to swallow the new official line.
- pmoriarty 6y ago
  "I'm not sure that explains the inability to swallow the new official line." How official is it? In the US, at least, the government spent many millions of dollars (hundreds of millions? billions?) on anti-drug education campaigns for decades, and there was mass media hysteria against drugs for decades. There are still no comparable pro-drug education campaigns, and while there have been some positive research results and positive media coverage on some drugs, the message overall is pretty mixed, and there's still plenty of anti-drug hysteria in the media and anti-drug messages from the government today. It's probably going to take a long time to change the minds of most people who grew up soaked in anti-drug propaganda.

nineplay 6y ago

Older generations? I hope you aren't talking about the baby boomers who practically created drug culture. "all drugs are bad" was a "greatest generation" attitude and I'm afraid they are mostly beyond caring

standardUser 6y ago
Sure, a sliver of the Baby Boomer generation has been given vastly too much attention for doing some drugs. Meanwhile, the bulk of that generation are responsible for the largest per capita prison population in the developed world and the ruin of millions of young lives.

eshack94 6y ago

Why do you wish shame on others? We should forgive others if possible.

standardUser 6y ago
Let's start by forgiving every non-violent drug offender rotting in prisons throughout the US. Then we can forgive those who put them there.

hn_asker 6y ago

The older generations definitely helped Big Pharma. I just hope these new treatments free us from the antipsychotic/antidepressant pseudoscience.

dang 6y ago

I'm late to this comment but please do not post unsubstantive flamebait like this, and especially not generational flamewar, which is one of the last things we need here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html