5 ms·

How much is $120B relative to the total assets held in the UK by Morgan Stanley? The number of jobs which have been moved out of London seems relatively small (

by arc0 6y ago

How much is $120B relative to the total assets held in the UK by Morgan Stanley? The number of jobs which have been moved out of London seems relatively small (7500 across the entire financial sector, single companies in London employee more than that).

nbevans 6y ago
My wife's department (at an unnamed major investment bank in London) just gave up on trying to hire for a position in Frankfurt. They'd been trying to fill it all year. They're now going to hire for it in their UK branch office (not London). By having the role in the UK will breach the EU regulations for the role in question - I don't know what their medium-long-term plans are though. It's a shit situation when you literally "can't find the staff".
- loremipsium 6y ago
  could you elaborate? I would have guessed that especially in finance hiring in major cities is just a matter of compensation.
  - arethuza 6y ago
    I think in every statement like "we can't find employees" there is an implicit "at the amount of money we want to pay".
    - arc0 6y ago
      Are German bankers paid that much more than British bankers then?
      - arethuza 6y ago
        I have no idea - perhaps there is a shortage of bankers in Germany because of banks moving there?
        greatpatton 6y ago
        I mean that can attract people from all over Europe to take these positions. It's likely a question of money.
        fmajid 6y ago
        And Frankfurt is not as attractive a place to live as London or Paris.
        cyberpunk 6y ago
        I dunno, I would trade london for just one more meal at konamon or muku ;)
        brewmarche 6y ago
        Getting reservations at Muku was never easy but always worth it
        HenryKissinger 6y ago
        Paris is a shithole.
        bengalister 6y ago
        As a French guy still living in France, I don't find Paris to be attractive at all. It is a dirty city, housing is expensive and generally in a poor state, and there a lot of security issues and social unrest: burglaries, violent protests (almost every week), periodic riots in some suburbs and terrorist attacks. To the point that more and more in the media, you hear about an upcoming civil war. Add that all the famous France's plagues: strikes, bureaucracy, very high income taxes for people earning more than 2000/m Euros and more recently communities living more and more separately. There is no social unrest in Germany, Frankfurt is much safer and Germany more reliable.
        ardit33 6y ago
        Frankfurt is a lovely place to live... I was surprised how cheap it was (compared to nyc and such). While not a world class city like NYC/London, it has a lot to offer, and it is on par with cities like Boston/Seatle/SF/W.DC/Lyon/Zurich etc... It is a solid 'upper middle' tier city, where everything is clean and neat.
      - travmatt 6y ago
        If everyone suddenly has great need of them while demand for British bankers collapses, then yes.
  - tremon 6y ago
    I'm guessing that at least some financial institutions have been moving (part of) their London operations to mainland Europe, thereby creating a shortage of available workers there. That will probably self-correct over time, but it doesn't help the situation right now.
  - nbevans 6y ago
    They were hiring for a low-rank employee that would take training and instructions from London.
_Microft 6y ago
Does their Wikipedia article [0] help to answer this question? It has numbers for 2020 in the table near the top. I would assume these number refer to the situation worldwide? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan_Stanley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan_Stanley
rndgermandude 6y ago
7500 was October, not it's more than 8000. That would make it about 3-4% of "high finance" positions* so far moved out of the UK into the EU. That's not an exodus yet, but it's not nothing either. Then again, a lot of the transitions aren't finished yet either, and a lot of it is dependent on the final Deal or No Deal. It also takes time to do the groundwork if you want to move, like create the legal infrastructure and entities and the associated due diligence, rent office space, hire or relocate people, and so on. So, it's too early yet to conclude anything in either direction, in my opinion. [*] Hard to tell what is the true number of "high finance" employees in the UK. Given there are roughly 180K finance and insurance employees in the City of London, and most of the "high finance" is concentrated there, I'd guestimate 200-250K such "high finance" employees in the UK total, but I could be massively wrong. There are numbers putting the full time financial and insurance employees in the UK at 1.1M employees, but that includes bank tellers dealing with people wanting to buy a house and agents selling life insurance, etc.

by arc0 6y ago

nbevans 6y ago

My wife's department (at an unnamed major investment bank in London) just gave up on trying to hire for a position in Frankfurt. They'd been trying to fill it all year. They're now going to hire for it in their UK branch office (not London). By having the role in the UK will breach the EU regulations for the role in question - I don't know what their medium-long-term plans are though. It's a shit situation when you literally "can't find the staff".

loremipsium 6y ago
could you elaborate? I would have guessed that especially in finance hiring in major cities is just a matter of compensation.
- arethuza 6y ago
  I think in every statement like "we can't find employees" there is an implicit "at the amount of money we want to pay".
  - arc0 6y ago
    Are German bankers paid that much more than British bankers then?
    - arethuza 6y ago
      I have no idea - perhaps there is a shortage of bankers in Germany because of banks moving there?
      - greatpatton 6y ago
        I mean that can attract people from all over Europe to take these positions. It's likely a question of money.
        fmajid 6y ago
        And Frankfurt is not as attractive a place to live as London or Paris.
        cyberpunk 6y ago
        I dunno, I would trade london for just one more meal at konamon or muku ;)
        brewmarche 6y ago
        Getting reservations at Muku was never easy but always worth it
        HenryKissinger 6y ago
        Paris is a shithole.
        bengalister 6y ago
        As a French guy still living in France, I don't find Paris to be attractive at all. It is a dirty city, housing is expensive and generally in a poor state, and there a lot of security issues and social unrest: burglaries, violent protests (almost every week), periodic riots in some suburbs and terrorist attacks. To the point that more and more in the media, you hear about an upcoming civil war. Add that all the famous France's plagues: strikes, bureaucracy, very high income taxes for people earning more than 2000/m Euros and more recently communities living more and more separately. There is no social unrest in Germany, Frankfurt is much safer and Germany more reliable.
        ardit33 6y ago
        Frankfurt is a lovely place to live... I was surprised how cheap it was (compared to nyc and such). While not a world class city like NYC/London, it has a lot to offer, and it is on par with cities like Boston/Seatle/SF/W.DC/Lyon/Zurich etc... It is a solid 'upper middle' tier city, where everything is clean and neat.
    - travmatt 6y ago
      If everyone suddenly has great need of them while demand for British bankers collapses, then yes.
- tremon 6y ago
  I'm guessing that at least some financial institutions have been moving (part of) their London operations to mainland Europe, thereby creating a shortage of available workers there. That will probably self-correct over time, but it doesn't help the situation right now.
- nbevans 6y ago
  They were hiring for a low-rank employee that would take training and instructions from London.

_Microft 6y ago

Does their Wikipedia article [0] help to answer this question? It has numbers for 2020 in the table near the top. I would assume these number refer to the situation worldwide? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan_Stanley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan_Stanley

rndgermandude 6y ago

7500 was October, not it's more than 8000. That would make it about 3-4% of "high finance" positions* so far moved out of the UK into the EU. That's not an exodus yet, but it's not nothing either. Then again, a lot of the transitions aren't finished yet either, and a lot of it is dependent on the final Deal or No Deal. It also takes time to do the groundwork if you want to move, like create the legal infrastructure and entities and the associated due diligence, rent office space, hire or relocate people, and so on. So, it's too early yet to conclude anything in either direction, in my opinion. [*] Hard to tell what is the true number of "high finance" employees in the UK. Given there are roughly 180K finance and insurance employees in the City of London, and most of the "high finance" is concentrated there, I'd guestimate 200-250K such "high finance" employees in the UK total, but I could be massively wrong. There are numbers putting the full time financial and insurance employees in the UK at 1.1M employees, but that includes bank tellers dealing with people wanting to buy a house and agents selling life insurance, etc.