5 ms·

It doesn’t pay to be the computer guy

43 points by fogus 15y ago

sudont 15y ago
I used to work in a factory. We had a big sign that said: "n days without an accident." There would be parties and bonuses if there were long stretches without major accidents, injuries and fuck-ups. We're programmers and hackers--why, exactly, can't we implement something like this in an afternoon, but for computer safety? http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/03/the-panic-status-board/ http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/03/the-panic-status-board/ Oh yeah, we're all Professionals, not tradesmen. It's a mentality thing. "Production" work isn't as highly regarded.
- corin_ 15y ago
  I rather like the idea of a "n days without a fuckup" sign, though I suspect if I were to make it for the office visiting clients might not always see the funny side..
  - sudont 15y ago
    http://www.aestheticapparatus.com/detail.php?uid=C7A668&subsection=Merchandise&status=yes http://www.aestheticapparatus.com/detail.php?uid=C7A668&... Signs can be switched...
    - corin_ 15y ago
      I can't help but feel that n would, far too often, have to be reset to 0 every time we forgot to make the switch before somebody arrives.
  - jchrisa 15y ago
    heh, this reminds me of last years github outage: https://github.com/blog/744-today-s-outage#comment-9179 https://github.com/blog/744-today-s-outage#comment-9179
  - wtracy 15y ago
    Then do a "n days without a network outage" sign instead.
- johndcook 15y ago
  Interesting idea. On the other hand, we're not as risk averse as plants wanting to avoid physical injury. Sometimes you can greatly reduce costs by tolerating a little higher risk of failure. But you need to be deliberate about it.
- cosgroveb 15y ago
  Kind of like this, for Reddit: http://redditincident.com/ http://redditincident.com/
wccrawford 15y ago
This seems to come up quite often and my answer is always the same: Make sure they notice you. I went years being un-noticed except during emergencies until I learned to make sure all my accomplishments were known. This is easily done by simply informing your manager of your progress often. The thing is, managers actually -like- being informed on a weekly (or even daily!) basis! So now you're not only getting credit for how hard you work, but also getting kudos for doing such a good job with 'communication' as well. Blow your own horn a bit. It's not as taboo as you think, and your boss will actually appreciate it. (Enthusiasm is another side-effect, too. You will appear to have it, even if you don't.)
- johndcook 15y ago
  I heard someone use the phrase "marketing as a moral imperative." You need to let people know what you can do so they can use your skills (without being a jerk about it).
- qntm 15y ago
  > The thing is, managers actually -like- being informed on a weekly (or even daily!) basis! This. As a coder, I like to be left alone and allowed to focus on the same thing for long periods of time. Interruptions break my train of thought, and task switching is mentally costly. Thus, out of courtesy, I used to make a habit of leaving managers undisturbed except during designated weekly meetings or via the occasional email if something important came up. It took me a long time to realise that managers are not like coders. Being informed makes their job easier - especially when you're ahead, but especially if you're falling behind.
  - wccrawford 15y ago
    That's a good point! I tend to treat others as I want to be treated, and it's hard for me to remember that that's not always best. The golden rule should be 'Do unto others as they would prefer' instead.
- chc 15y ago
  Not only do managers like being apprised of what's going on, but all those things you're doing to help the company also help your manager look good in meetings with his or her boss — and making the person who writes your paychecks look good is just about the best thing you can do in business, in my experience.
synnik 15y ago
I recommend that people go one level deeper than this. Keeping things running smoothly is the lowest level requirement of IT work, not a major accomplishment. The really great IT folk that I know spend 5-10 hours a week on trouble tickets, keeping things running, etc. The other 30-40 hours are spent on projects, improving the business. And those projects get visibility. So you have the guy in the corner who is so good that everything runs smoothly, and nobody knows he is there. Or the guy next to him who chooses to do that... and then even more. Guess which guy really deserves more recognition?
- r00fus 15y ago
  Not sure I've ever experience this (having worked in dozens of large and small outfits). Usually IT is split between operations and projects; The project guy(s) being software oriented, the ops folks being hardware/network. It's rare to see someone who has command of both remain in IT... if you have that skill set you can easily be a hired gun for much more (or run your own company/startup). ... which is the point of the article.
heyrhett 15y ago
"The system's running smoothly, so why am I paying IT?" "The system's down again, so why am I paying IT?"
- ChuckMcM 15y ago
  Heh, the life of the systems person. Employee, "How do I know I'm doing a good job?" Manager, "Nobody is complaining." If people can't be bothered to understand how the folks in operations are making their lives easier, then they probably should not be judging their contribution. Everyone has an opinion of course. If you work in an operations group (and especially if you are working for me :-) you should have two things on your plate at all times: 1) A situational awareness of how things you are responsible for are going. 2) Project(s) for providing either data or analysis on how things are going. It helps if you understand a risk model about things and can prioritize your attention using that model. (if system x breaks the product for the company stops earning revenue == high priorty, system z breaks and nobody will notice for a day or two == low priority)
noonespecial 15y ago
One of the best choices I've ever made was to stop using windows. I did this in the early part of 2002. I swtiched to linux and MAC. I can get things done in all 3 os's and when I was using Windows XP, I liked it. My XP machines were kept clean and fast and i knew my way around. I'm not an OS bigot or a Stallmaninte, I just took a job that was all unix and windows became cumbersome. As XP receded into my rear-view, I found that I was able to start telling people "Oh, Windows, I don't know anything about that because I haven't used it since 2002. Sorry, I wish I could help." Now I can tell people I'm a computer guy, have a short conversation about the cool parts of the job, dodge the home computer questions in seconds and move on. Bliss.
- georgieporgie 15y ago
  linux and MAC Is that a subtle joke...?
- cosgroveb 15y ago
  I've noticed this is slowly becoming me. I actually don't know my way around Windows 7! It bothers me sometimes when I can't answer a question about someone's home computer (although I could still figure it out if pressed), but friends and family are less expecting of free tech support these days because I'm more willing to say "I don't know, sorry." They probably assume I'm bad at my "computer job" (programming) by now though...
- wazoox 15y ago
  This story looks similar to mine, except that the last Windows version I really used was Win98SE. I even went further : for those of my family wanting my help, I made them switch to Linux and guess what? They never needed to call. It's not so much that Linux is unbreakable, but that they don't know how to install whatever stupid apps (laden with virus), they don't know how to upgrade their drivers (and they don't need to), etc.
furyg3 15y ago
This weekend I was interrupted during a shower (twice!) because an in-law couldn't get something on an iPad set up for mother's day. I had a good laugh about it, but it just goes to show that people expect you to know everything about every technology, at a moment's notice, for free, and love helping. It's just not the same for other professions (you wouldn't ask your neighbor the plumber to install a new sink for you for free while you go off and run some errands). I think there's some combination of "he's a computer genius so it's a breeze for him!" and "he loves working with computers so he doesn't mind!" which leads people to think that it's ok to ask for 'help' without even marginal compensation.
- _delirium 15y ago
  I agree it's odd, and I've long since passed the point of finding it tedious, but I don't think it's completely groundless. When I was a teenager, I did like helping random people I knew fix computer problems, and I think that's prevalent in a way that teenagers who enjoy fixing plumbing isn't. It was a mixture of liking that I had some skill that people valued, and enjoying some of the problem-solving and learning aspect of trying to track down bugs and solutions.
ankimal 15y ago
I think it totally depends on what kind of computer guy you are. A product company with a web/IT product is as good as its IT/dev team. In fact, most times business itself doesnt know what the next big thing should be.
wh-uws 15y ago
I always get frustrated when I read articles like the one mentioned in this one (Specifically the "10 reasons why it doesn't pay to be a computer guy" on) because there are several items at play here that always seem to be invisible to the authors: 1) Being able to say no is an important skill Especially when it comes to being asked to use your computer related skill. If you can't or don't want to help a person SAY THAT! I personally do happen to like troubleshooting. I get some kind of twisted pleasure out of figuring out an edge cases or why a program, operating system, or device doesn't work. Its fun for me. But if that's not you then let people know so that you and they don't have to be frustrated. 2) if you don't make people realize your value some people just won't Many talented "computer guys" are introverted people who haven't learned to defend their worth. Of course what you do is important! Could they have gotten it fixed without you?

43 points by fogus 15y ago

I used to work in a factory. We had a big sign that said: "n days without an accident." There would be parties and bonuses if there were long stretches without major accidents, injuries and fuck-ups. We're programmers and hackers--why, exactly, can't we implement something like this in an afternoon, but for computer safety? http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/03/the-panic-status-board/ http://www.panic.com/blog/2010/03/the-panic-status-board/ Oh yeah, we're all Professionals, not tradesmen. It's a mentality thing. "Production" work isn't as highly regarded.

corin_ 15y ago
I rather like the idea of a "n days without a fuckup" sign, though I suspect if I were to make it for the office visiting clients might not always see the funny side..
- sudont 15y ago
  http://www.aestheticapparatus.com/detail.php?uid=C7A668&subsection=Merchandise&status=yes http://www.aestheticapparatus.com/detail.php?uid=C7A668&... Signs can be switched...
  - corin_ 15y ago
    I can't help but feel that n would, far too often, have to be reset to 0 every time we forgot to make the switch before somebody arrives.
- jchrisa 15y ago
  heh, this reminds me of last years github outage: https://github.com/blog/744-today-s-outage#comment-9179 https://github.com/blog/744-today-s-outage#comment-9179
- wtracy 15y ago
  Then do a "n days without a network outage" sign instead.
johndcook 15y ago
Interesting idea. On the other hand, we're not as risk averse as plants wanting to avoid physical injury. Sometimes you can greatly reduce costs by tolerating a little higher risk of failure. But you need to be deliberate about it.
cosgroveb 15y ago
Kind of like this, for Reddit: http://redditincident.com/ http://redditincident.com/

wccrawford 15y ago

This seems to come up quite often and my answer is always the same: Make sure they notice you. I went years being un-noticed except during emergencies until I learned to make sure all my accomplishments were known. This is easily done by simply informing your manager of your progress often. The thing is, managers actually -like- being informed on a weekly (or even daily!) basis! So now you're not only getting credit for how hard you work, but also getting kudos for doing such a good job with 'communication' as well. Blow your own horn a bit. It's not as taboo as you think, and your boss will actually appreciate it. (Enthusiasm is another side-effect, too. You will appear to have it, even if you don't.)

johndcook 15y ago
I heard someone use the phrase "marketing as a moral imperative." You need to let people know what you can do so they can use your skills (without being a jerk about it).
qntm 15y ago
> The thing is, managers actually -like- being informed on a weekly (or even daily!) basis! This. As a coder, I like to be left alone and allowed to focus on the same thing for long periods of time. Interruptions break my train of thought, and task switching is mentally costly. Thus, out of courtesy, I used to make a habit of leaving managers undisturbed except during designated weekly meetings or via the occasional email if something important came up. It took me a long time to realise that managers are not like coders. Being informed makes their job easier - especially when you're ahead, but especially if you're falling behind.
- wccrawford 15y ago
  That's a good point! I tend to treat others as I want to be treated, and it's hard for me to remember that that's not always best. The golden rule should be 'Do unto others as they would prefer' instead.
chc 15y ago
Not only do managers like being apprised of what's going on, but all those things you're doing to help the company also help your manager look good in meetings with his or her boss — and making the person who writes your paychecks look good is just about the best thing you can do in business, in my experience.

synnik 15y ago

I recommend that people go one level deeper than this. Keeping things running smoothly is the lowest level requirement of IT work, not a major accomplishment. The really great IT folk that I know spend 5-10 hours a week on trouble tickets, keeping things running, etc. The other 30-40 hours are spent on projects, improving the business. And those projects get visibility. So you have the guy in the corner who is so good that everything runs smoothly, and nobody knows he is there. Or the guy next to him who chooses to do that... and then even more. Guess which guy really deserves more recognition?

r00fus 15y ago
Not sure I've ever experience this (having worked in dozens of large and small outfits). Usually IT is split between operations and projects; The project guy(s) being software oriented, the ops folks being hardware/network. It's rare to see someone who has command of both remain in IT... if you have that skill set you can easily be a hired gun for much more (or run your own company/startup). ... which is the point of the article.

heyrhett 15y ago

"The system's running smoothly, so why am I paying IT?" "The system's down again, so why am I paying IT?"

ChuckMcM 15y ago
Heh, the life of the systems person. Employee, "How do I know I'm doing a good job?" Manager, "Nobody is complaining." If people can't be bothered to understand how the folks in operations are making their lives easier, then they probably should not be judging their contribution. Everyone has an opinion of course. If you work in an operations group (and especially if you are working for me :-) you should have two things on your plate at all times: 1) A situational awareness of how things you are responsible for are going. 2) Project(s) for providing either data or analysis on how things are going. It helps if you understand a risk model about things and can prioritize your attention using that model. (if system x breaks the product for the company stops earning revenue == high priorty, system z breaks and nobody will notice for a day or two == low priority)

noonespecial 15y ago

One of the best choices I've ever made was to stop using windows. I did this in the early part of 2002. I swtiched to linux and MAC. I can get things done in all 3 os's and when I was using Windows XP, I liked it. My XP machines were kept clean and fast and i knew my way around. I'm not an OS bigot or a Stallmaninte, I just took a job that was all unix and windows became cumbersome. As XP receded into my rear-view, I found that I was able to start telling people "Oh, Windows, I don't know anything about that because I haven't used it since 2002. Sorry, I wish I could help." Now I can tell people I'm a computer guy, have a short conversation about the cool parts of the job, dodge the home computer questions in seconds and move on. Bliss.

georgieporgie 15y ago
linux and MAC Is that a subtle joke...?
cosgroveb 15y ago
I've noticed this is slowly becoming me. I actually don't know my way around Windows 7! It bothers me sometimes when I can't answer a question about someone's home computer (although I could still figure it out if pressed), but friends and family are less expecting of free tech support these days because I'm more willing to say "I don't know, sorry." They probably assume I'm bad at my "computer job" (programming) by now though...
wazoox 15y ago
This story looks similar to mine, except that the last Windows version I really used was Win98SE. I even went further : for those of my family wanting my help, I made them switch to Linux and guess what? They never needed to call. It's not so much that Linux is unbreakable, but that they don't know how to install whatever stupid apps (laden with virus), they don't know how to upgrade their drivers (and they don't need to), etc.

furyg3 15y ago

This weekend I was interrupted during a shower (twice!) because an in-law couldn't get something on an iPad set up for mother's day. I had a good laugh about it, but it just goes to show that people expect you to know everything about every technology, at a moment's notice, for free, and love helping. It's just not the same for other professions (you wouldn't ask your neighbor the plumber to install a new sink for you for free while you go off and run some errands). I think there's some combination of "he's a computer genius so it's a breeze for him!" and "he loves working with computers so he doesn't mind!" which leads people to think that it's ok to ask for 'help' without even marginal compensation.

_delirium 15y ago
I agree it's odd, and I've long since passed the point of finding it tedious, but I don't think it's completely groundless. When I was a teenager, I did like helping random people I knew fix computer problems, and I think that's prevalent in a way that teenagers who enjoy fixing plumbing isn't. It was a mixture of liking that I had some skill that people valued, and enjoying some of the problem-solving and learning aspect of trying to track down bugs and solutions.

ankimal 15y ago

I think it totally depends on what kind of computer guy you are. A product company with a web/IT product is as good as its IT/dev team. In fact, most times business itself doesnt know what the next big thing should be.

wh-uws 15y ago

I always get frustrated when I read articles like the one mentioned in this one (Specifically the "10 reasons why it doesn't pay to be a computer guy" on) because there are several items at play here that always seem to be invisible to the authors: 1) Being able to say no is an important skill Especially when it comes to being asked to use your computer related skill. If you can't or don't want to help a person SAY THAT! I personally do happen to like troubleshooting. I get some kind of twisted pleasure out of figuring out an edge cases or why a program, operating system, or device doesn't work. Its fun for me. But if that's not you then let people know so that you and they don't have to be frustrated. 2) if you don't make people realize your value some people just won't Many talented "computer guys" are introverted people who haven't learned to defend their worth. Of course what you do is important! Could they have gotten it fixed without you?