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Some views Moderate Democrats held in the 90s could be very far right, depending on the subject. Bill Clinton supported "Don't ask, don't tell" and the defense

Some views Moderate Democrats held in the 90s could be very far right, depending on the subject. Bill Clinton supported "Don't ask, don't tell" and the defense of marriage act. They were considered moderate in the 90s, but I would classify them as far right today. A moderate in the 1930s could literally have supported Fascism, and the "progressive" Woodrow Wilson supported the Klu Klux Klan. I'm not saying this applies to you, but "moderate XX years ago" is not an argument against something being far right.

monoideism 6y ago
Exactly. By your standards, Bill Clinton was "far right". Excellent example. For the record, I support civil rights protections for all humans, including gays on the basis on sexual orientation. I disagreed then with most of Bill Clinton's policies toward gay rights (I also strongly supported making marriage a uniquely civil institution vis-a-vis government recognition available to all citizens, like France). By the way, you know who else had that exact same views on gay rights as Bill Clinton when he entered office? Barack Obama. Was he "far right" in 2008?
- tick_tock_tick 6y ago
  If you didn't say it was Obama and polled Democrat's based on his actions/views I'd be pretty confident they'd say "far right".
  - monoideism 6y ago
    I'm pretty sure you're right, particularly if you combined the socio-cultural views from his first term and the global military actions of the second. It's absolutely untethered how far much of the left has moved in 10-15 years. The right has also moved toward the right, but they're much less homogeneous in their beliefs. This is reflected in polls over time from Pew and others: https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/interactives/political-polarization-1994-2017/ https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/interactives/political-... (click "animate" to see to 2017).
notsureaboutpg 6y ago
>Bill Clinton supported "Don't ask, don't tell" and the defense of marriage act. They were considered moderate in the 90s, but I would classify them as far right today. Perfect example of why the question had to be asked. Most people in America would not consider those positions to be far-right today. Most immigrants to the US today would also have those positions if asked. Everyone in my parents' generation still has those views, and my generation is split on the issue. Don't ask don't tell and the Defense of Marriage act can coexist with a tolerant society. It's not "far-right" to believe that marriage is only between men and women and to still believe that LGBT people have the same rights as everyone else. EDIT: Further data. Pew says that in 2019(!) 49% of black Americans did not support extending marriage to LGBT people. Are 49% of black Americans far-right? Obviously not, but intellectual circles in the US have moved so far to the left that this is a serious statement they would make. (https://www.pewforum.org/fact-sheet/changing-attitudes-on-gay-marriage/ https://www.pewforum.org/fact-sheet/changing-attitudes-on-ga...)

monoideism 6y ago

Exactly. By your standards, Bill Clinton was "far right". Excellent example. For the record, I support civil rights protections for all humans, including gays on the basis on sexual orientation. I disagreed then with most of Bill Clinton's policies toward gay rights (I also strongly supported making marriage a uniquely civil institution vis-a-vis government recognition available to all citizens, like France). By the way, you know who else had that exact same views on gay rights as Bill Clinton when he entered office? Barack Obama. Was he "far right" in 2008?

tick_tock_tick 6y ago
If you didn't say it was Obama and polled Democrat's based on his actions/views I'd be pretty confident they'd say "far right".
- monoideism 6y ago
  I'm pretty sure you're right, particularly if you combined the socio-cultural views from his first term and the global military actions of the second. It's absolutely untethered how far much of the left has moved in 10-15 years. The right has also moved toward the right, but they're much less homogeneous in their beliefs. This is reflected in polls over time from Pew and others: https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/interactives/political-polarization-1994-2017/ https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/interactives/political-... (click "animate" to see to 2017).

notsureaboutpg 6y ago

>Bill Clinton supported "Don't ask, don't tell" and the defense of marriage act. They were considered moderate in the 90s, but I would classify them as far right today. Perfect example of why the question had to be asked. Most people in America would not consider those positions to be far-right today. Most immigrants to the US today would also have those positions if asked. Everyone in my parents' generation still has those views, and my generation is split on the issue. Don't ask don't tell and the Defense of Marriage act can coexist with a tolerant society. It's not "far-right" to believe that marriage is only between men and women and to still believe that LGBT people have the same rights as everyone else. EDIT: Further data. Pew says that in 2019(!) 49% of black Americans did not support extending marriage to LGBT people. Are 49% of black Americans far-right? Obviously not, but intellectual circles in the US have moved so far to the left that this is a serious statement they would make. (https://www.pewforum.org/fact-sheet/changing-attitudes-on-gay-marriage/ https://www.pewforum.org/fact-sheet/changing-attitudes-on-ga...)