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How do you explain "Russiagate"? I just got through 4 years of unbridled partisanness that puts your entire post in to question.

by zests 6y ago

nemothekid 6y ago
I don't see how Russiagate is at odds with what neogodless said. The democrats collected evidence, went to court, and lost. Russiagate, however misfounded, was legal. To imply that there were no other avenues for them to go down so they turned to voter fraud is laughable. Also, I will try to say this in the nicest way possible, but you are repeating, nearly verbatim, talking points that the President has been using for months in various rallies. The idea that the democrats needed to turn to voter fraud to ensure Biden won a Trump talking point - not something born out of any sort of rumor or leak. What is particularly nefarious about this talking point is it's not something he crafted out of the blue, but it is one that he has been forming since at least July. He has carefully planned to use pandemic and the growth in mail in ballots to throw chaos into the electoral process. In other words, I'm asking you take a step back and consider if voter fraud is a credible rumor or if its something that has been manufactured by the right wing media machine.
- zests 6y ago
  I don't listen to right wing media. Or left wing media. They're both terrible. (I pay for my news to try an avoid the nonsense.) I will say this nicely as well, you should re-read my argument to see where the depth lies. I take caution to ask a simple "IF/THEN" question that's really just a latent criticism of media including social media. The idea that "voter fraud" is some "Trump concocted nefarious scheme" is also rather ridiculous. Voter fraud gets claimed after every election. I hope our new censorship overlords are fair and honest in their censorship.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    > I don't listen to right wing media. Or left wing media. They're both terrible. One is substantially more terrible than the other, and seems to be perpetually stuck in lala land. > Voter fraud gets claimed after every election. Not at this scale.
    - openyoureyesman 6y ago
      > 'One is substantially more terrible than the other, and seems to be perpetually stuck in lala land.' Wrong. YOU ARE ALL CLUELESS, AND EQUALLY VILE CREATURES.
  - justin66 6y ago
    > I pay for my news to try an avoid the nonsense. I sincerely applaud your paying for news, but a person who gets all their news via the free AP News and Reuters newsfeeds, cspan, PBS, VOA, Propublica, NPR, and so on can be very well informed and avoid a fair amount of nonsense.
- ksk 6y ago
  >The democrats collected evidence, went to court, and lost. Russiagate, however misfounded, was legal. To imply that there were no other avenues for them to go down so they turned to voter fraud is laughable. You forgot a few steps. First, they claimed there was fraud (w/o evidence). Then they 'leaked' the Steele dossier and other nonsense documents. Then, there was 24/7 wall to wall coverage for months and months of it (including insane stuff like the pee tape) to manufacture consent. High profile Democrats happily went on TV expressing fake concern and repeated unproven allegations. They happily were the 'inside source' to NYTimes, rollingstone, nymag, etc, etc for more ridiculous stories. Then, they wasted tax payer money knowing full well that it was bogus. Respectfully, I would invite you to do the same as you ask others. Take a step back, and consider (even if you aren't convinced) whether you've been had by the Dems on the most ridiculous story (if not on all of them) about Trump.
  - djsumdog 6y ago
    I agree. This is all established fact. Look at the FISA and the Carter Page lawsuit. A government informant leaked fake information to the press and the FISA warrant was based on that information. They literally made up information to get a warrant. That's literally a baseless allegation and all the documents that have come out in discovery back that up. I think there are two fundamentally different worlds here. Many of the people in this thread, and in big tech, still trust CNN/FOX/MSNBC/NYTimes. But if you look at the past four years, they've constantly given us bad information, or used misleading headlines (most people don't read past the headlines), and often the content of the post itself contradicts the headline. That's why this YouTube thing is so important. People like Shapiro, Megan Kelly, Tim Pool, Viva Frei, No Agenda .. they actually dig through this stuff and expose how corrurpt the media really is .. and they are insanely corrurpt. We've had months of "mostly peaceful protestors" and I've watched people all around me on the left defend the burning and looting. "It's just property." The media is corrurpt and this shows YouTube/Google is just as corrurpt, trying to use their massive influence to control a narrative; making something absolute that should be brought deeply into question. We are not in 1984. We've been in 1984 for decades. It's just now the Internet has allowed people to see that for themselves, and Big Tech wants to take that away and tell people what to think again.
neogodless 6y ago
I'm not a fan of the partisan nature of our politics, or the political theater of Russiagate. Out of curiosity, did you mean: partisanism? I accepted that President Donald Trump won the electoral college in 2016, and that he lost it in 2020. I don't think Democrats trying to get a few million people in on an election fraud conspiracy would have been good for the country, and I don't think Democratic politicians believed that was a good idea either.
Talanes 6y ago
Democrats believe in the process so much they would rather waste four years convincing themselves a red herring is more than a fish. If they were as conniving as you have been implying, they would have either gotten results or switched tactics sooner. They're rule-followers. That doesn't mean they're smart.
ksk 6y ago
GOP doesn't want Trumps cult to turn on them, Democrats don't want the cult on the left to turn on them either ;) It's a bit funny both sides proclaim that only the other side is in a bubble.
- chillwaves 6y ago
  It's funny to pretend that 2016 election interference from the Russians didn't happen, even though every single intelligence agency (under Trump, by the way) agreed that it did.

How do you explain "Russiagate"? I just got through 4 years of unbridled partisanness that puts your entire post in to question.

by zests 6y ago

How do you explain "Russiagate"? I just got through 4 years of unbridled partisanness that puts your entire post in to question.

nemothekid 6y ago

I don't see how Russiagate is at odds with what neogodless said. The democrats collected evidence, went to court, and lost. Russiagate, however misfounded, was legal. To imply that there were no other avenues for them to go down so they turned to voter fraud is laughable. Also, I will try to say this in the nicest way possible, but you are repeating, nearly verbatim, talking points that the President has been using for months in various rallies. The idea that the democrats needed to turn to voter fraud to ensure Biden won a Trump talking point - not something born out of any sort of rumor or leak. What is particularly nefarious about this talking point is it's not something he crafted out of the blue, but it is one that he has been forming since at least July. He has carefully planned to use pandemic and the growth in mail in ballots to throw chaos into the electoral process. In other words, I'm asking you take a step back and consider if voter fraud is a credible rumor or if its something that has been manufactured by the right wing media machine.

zests 6y ago
I don't listen to right wing media. Or left wing media. They're both terrible. (I pay for my news to try an avoid the nonsense.) I will say this nicely as well, you should re-read my argument to see where the depth lies. I take caution to ask a simple "IF/THEN" question that's really just a latent criticism of media including social media. The idea that "voter fraud" is some "Trump concocted nefarious scheme" is also rather ridiculous. Voter fraud gets claimed after every election. I hope our new censorship overlords are fair and honest in their censorship.
- jacquesm 6y ago
  > I don't listen to right wing media. Or left wing media. They're both terrible. One is substantially more terrible than the other, and seems to be perpetually stuck in lala land. > Voter fraud gets claimed after every election. Not at this scale.
  - openyoureyesman 6y ago
    > 'One is substantially more terrible than the other, and seems to be perpetually stuck in lala land.' Wrong. YOU ARE ALL CLUELESS, AND EQUALLY VILE CREATURES.
- justin66 6y ago
  > I pay for my news to try an avoid the nonsense. I sincerely applaud your paying for news, but a person who gets all their news via the free AP News and Reuters newsfeeds, cspan, PBS, VOA, Propublica, NPR, and so on can be very well informed and avoid a fair amount of nonsense.
ksk 6y ago
>The democrats collected evidence, went to court, and lost. Russiagate, however misfounded, was legal. To imply that there were no other avenues for them to go down so they turned to voter fraud is laughable. You forgot a few steps. First, they claimed there was fraud (w/o evidence). Then they 'leaked' the Steele dossier and other nonsense documents. Then, there was 24/7 wall to wall coverage for months and months of it (including insane stuff like the pee tape) to manufacture consent. High profile Democrats happily went on TV expressing fake concern and repeated unproven allegations. They happily were the 'inside source' to NYTimes, rollingstone, nymag, etc, etc for more ridiculous stories. Then, they wasted tax payer money knowing full well that it was bogus. Respectfully, I would invite you to do the same as you ask others. Take a step back, and consider (even if you aren't convinced) whether you've been had by the Dems on the most ridiculous story (if not on all of them) about Trump.
- djsumdog 6y ago
  I agree. This is all established fact. Look at the FISA and the Carter Page lawsuit. A government informant leaked fake information to the press and the FISA warrant was based on that information. They literally made up information to get a warrant. That's literally a baseless allegation and all the documents that have come out in discovery back that up. I think there are two fundamentally different worlds here. Many of the people in this thread, and in big tech, still trust CNN/FOX/MSNBC/NYTimes. But if you look at the past four years, they've constantly given us bad information, or used misleading headlines (most people don't read past the headlines), and often the content of the post itself contradicts the headline. That's why this YouTube thing is so important. People like Shapiro, Megan Kelly, Tim Pool, Viva Frei, No Agenda .. they actually dig through this stuff and expose how corrurpt the media really is .. and they are insanely corrurpt. We've had months of "mostly peaceful protestors" and I've watched people all around me on the left defend the burning and looting. "It's just property." The media is corrurpt and this shows YouTube/Google is just as corrurpt, trying to use their massive influence to control a narrative; making something absolute that should be brought deeply into question. We are not in 1984. We've been in 1984 for decades. It's just now the Internet has allowed people to see that for themselves, and Big Tech wants to take that away and tell people what to think again.

neogodless 6y ago

I'm not a fan of the partisan nature of our politics, or the political theater of Russiagate. Out of curiosity, did you mean: partisanism? I accepted that President Donald Trump won the electoral college in 2016, and that he lost it in 2020. I don't think Democrats trying to get a few million people in on an election fraud conspiracy would have been good for the country, and I don't think Democratic politicians believed that was a good idea either.

Talanes 6y ago

Democrats believe in the process so much they would rather waste four years convincing themselves a red herring is more than a fish. If they were as conniving as you have been implying, they would have either gotten results or switched tactics sooner. They're rule-followers. That doesn't mean they're smart.

ksk 6y ago

GOP doesn't want Trumps cult to turn on them, Democrats don't want the cult on the left to turn on them either ;) It's a bit funny both sides proclaim that only the other side is in a bubble.

chillwaves 6y ago
It's funny to pretend that 2016 election interference from the Russians didn't happen, even though every single intelligence agency (under Trump, by the way) agreed that it did.