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Unpopular opinion: it is much better to have a leader hated by the media and who's every move is scrutinized by the press than to have a leader cowtowed by the
by Andrew_nenakhov 6y ago
Unpopular opinion: it is much better to have a leader hated by the media and who's every move is scrutinized by the press than to have a leader cowtowed by the press and given a free pass on anything.
How do I know? I'm from Russia. Authoritatism begins with tight control of news sources.
- dalbasal 6y agoI think this comment is underrated. Even using the term "censorship" is somewhat dubious when/if the "censor" is acting against the interests/wishes of government. That said, I think google are making a bad mistake here. They've crossed a line that they've been toeing. Social media isn't just a mass media. Media is always edited. Editing isn't censorship. But social media is also a communication channel. Haphazard interference in a communication channel sits wrong. We have no frame of reference for it. Meanwhile, there are credible claims that social media fallacies have caused horrible things (including possibly genocide in Myanmar) in other countries/languages. FB (in that case) has no knowledge of the language or interest in getting involved in that. How can you justify one without the other?
- lalaland1125 6y agoThis comment is really weird. There is a good reason why the media publishes more negative articles about some presidents and fewer on others; some presidents are legitimately better or worse than others.
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y agoBy this metric, Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong Un are greatest leaders the world has ever seen.
- knowaveragejoe 6y agoNo serious person with an interest in politics respects the state-sponsored news outlets of Russia or DPRK, but okay.
- ed25519FUUU 6y agoAre you implying that political pressure might mean some leaders get more bad press than others?
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y agoNo-one respects CNN and the likes also. They are just like Newsmax, but serving the opposite side.
- lalaland1125 6y agoDo you seriously believe that CNN's standards for truth are just as bad as Newsmax? That's quite a claim.
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y agoI see their standards to be just about the same with Russian state propaganda channels. If you'd seen them both you'd be amazed with the similarity. Unless,of course, you would choose to overlook it - people often shield themselves from the information that doesn't fit their paradigm.
- djsumdog 6y agoBiden has gotten zero bad press. Twitter and Facebook literally squashed the Hunter Biden story showing evidence of strong ties to Ukraine and China. Biden has only been given softballs in interviews and the media stands behind the fact he's cognitively sound when he obviously isn't. The media is solidly in the house of of the establishment that led to the Bush/Clinton dynasty. They do not care about the truth. Let's look at Gov Whitmer and Cummo. Their decisions lead to the deaths of thousands of elderly because they stuffed them all together in nursing homes that were not equipped for COVID. The media has done NOTHING about this story. Cummo wrote a fucking book praising himself!! Biden and Harris will never face the same scrutiny Trump has.
- wwright 6y agoHave you even tried google news sources critical of Whitmer, Cuomo, or Biden? There are plenty of critics. Of course, it’s hard to be more critical to them than to an idiot who told people to inject bleach; that’s just to be expected, though.
- djsumdog 6y ago> idiot who told people to inject bleach This literally didn't happen. His whole "cleansing" statement was cringy, yes. But he never told them to drink, inject or enema bleach. There was one person who did, for whatever reasons ... and really we should have let that problem solve itself.
- mike00632 6y agoYou're right. It was about injecting "disinfectant". The lying media keeps saying "bleach" when he was actually talking about bringing stuff like Lysol into the body. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-suggests-injection-disinfectant-beat-coronavirus-clean-lungs-n1191216 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-suggests...
- SurfingToad 6y agoThe Hunter Biden story was such an embarrassingly obvious piece of kompromat that it would have irresponsible to run with it just because the Trump campaign tried to push it out there. The reason why several major media outlets ignored the story is that they didn't want to play ball this time. They have written about this. They don't have an obligation to present strategically-crafted stories as if it were real news. Do you think Trump is throwing pardons around just for shits and giggles? This is the first time ever that a US president has been using pardons as get-out-of-jail-free cards for his friends and allies. And he's throwing them around because he has a habit of associating himself with criminals who commit crimes (on his behalf) and therefore need pardons. Trump wants to pardon his family, Giuliani, and potentially even himself. Which would not make the slightest bit of sense unless they had committed serious crimes. And if you argue that he wants to use the pardons to prevent those pesky democrats from setting him up, I want you to imagine a scenario where Biden was doing the exact same thing. Biden and Harris will be scrutinized in much the same way presidents and their VPs have been traditionally. Trump is an anomaly.
- 0x445442 6y agoThere's no way to square this statement given the coverage of Obama and Trump looking only at their policies.
- TheCoelacanth 6y agoWhy would you only look at "policies" instead of everything they do in an official capacity? "Policies" are basically just the stories that politicians tell about themselves. What they actually do matters, not just what they claim to support.
- cynoclast 6y agoAnd sometimes the media is simply biased against that president: https://www.npr.org/2017/10/02/555092743/study-news-coverage-of-trump-more-negative-than-for-other-presidents https://www.npr.org/2017/10/02/555092743/study-news-coverage...
- slcjordan 6y agoI thought it was a good comment. I don't know why the left fears a legitimately impartial press instead of one that leaks debate questions to the Democratic candidate.
- nfoz 6y agoSource for the debate question leak? The one I know of was given to Clinton against Sanders in the Democratic primary... so it was the "further left" being antagonized lol. But if there's a recent instance of this between a Democrat vs Republican debate I'd be interested to hear of it.
- sgustard 6y agoAlso debunked as false. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/clinton-received-debate-questions-week-before-debate/ https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/clinton-received-debate-qu...
- Merman_Mike 6y agoIt's funny when people try to play this up as some huge scandal. Someone told Clinton's campaign manager that there would be a question by a woman experiencing heath problems related to Flint's water supply. [1] The debate was being held in Flint. Do you think maybe everyone kind of knew that one was coming? [1] https://thehill.com/policy/cybersecurity/303556-emails-brazile-leaked-debate-question-to-clinton-camp https://thehill.com/policy/cybersecurity/303556-emails-brazi...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- disgrunt 6y agoSeriously? This president has not started/entered into a war for the first time since Carter, reformed the criminal justice system to reverse laws that unfairly targeted minorities and non-violent drug crimes (laws supported by Biden when they were passed, btw), presided over a record low unemployment rate and record high wage increases for American workers prior to the pandemic and the media treats him like he's the reincarnation of Hitler. Imagine if Obama reformed the criminal justice system, wasn't a war monger in Syria/Libya and presided over a record economic boom? He'd be made a saint or something. Go figure.
- Sophistifunk 6y agoThis is definitely true when the boss-man doesn't change. But these people aren't against power, or even against power used abusively against the people - they're only against "the other team" and clearly happy to cover up just about any bad actions of their preferred team.
- ed25519FUUU 6y agoI’m not sure who “these people” are, but this policy for everyone. What happens when “these people” is you?
- dec0dedab0de 6y agoI live in the US and I've said this for decades. I wish the media were just as hard on the politicians they agree with. The one thing different about trump is that he purposely provoked the media and responded to petty nonsense that previous presidents would have just ignored. Trump and the media have a symbiotic relationship because they both need the attention.
- cyberlurker 6y agoNo, there were other differences. Let’s just go with his most recent example: He’s still refuting election results with no evidence to backup his claim.
- nostromo 6y agoJust like Gore in 2000, who didn't concede until December 13th after every avenue to victory he had was closed. Let the process play out. He'll have his day in court and will either win or lose, just like Bush and Gore. Trying to rush things would have the opposite effect of building faith in the system.
- beezle 6y agoThere is no equivalence between Gore in 2000 and Trump in 2020. Gore demanded a recount of the exceedingly close outcome in Florda, one which hinged in large part on the accurate counting of the dreadful butterfly ballot. Gore at no time said, nor pressured anyone else to say, 'Its all fraud! Throw out all the votes and have the legislature put my elector slate in'
- beezle 6y agoIt seems funny to me that when people say things about the "media" they by implication omit such members as Fox News, the many, many right leaning web-only news sites and "conservative" talk radio (terrestrial and sat). In addition, much of "local" tv news stations are owned by conservative leaning Sinclair Broadcasting, an ownership which has pressed its own views on the reporting of news by its properties.
- syndacks 6y agoYouTube !== Government Your comparison is off.
- korantu 6y agoMy understanding of GP point is that majority of social media companies is negative to Trump and positive to Biden. The difference with Russia is that media is controlled by government, but the original point is that it is healthier when media scrutinises government
- edmundsauto 6y ago> My understanding of GP point is that majority of social media companies is negative to Trump and positive to Biden I don't think this is accurate, unless you mean that most employees of big tech vote/contribute Democrat. However, it doesn't necessarily follow that bias exists on the platform.
- cgrealy 6y agocitation very much needed. Just because content on social media is negative towards Trump, doesn't mean the platform itself is. In fact, Twitter has been incredibly lenient with Trump. Much of what he tweets (threats for example) contravene the TOS.
- jcranmer 6y agoAs I recall, after his election, Twitter explicitly updated its TOS to basically say that they don't apply to certain public figures, in effect admitting that he does violate the TOS but they are unwilling to do anything about it.
- julianapostate 6y agohttps://www.newsweek.com/big-tech-employees-donate-overwhelmingly-2020-democrats-1515430 https://www.newsweek.com/big-tech-employees-donate-overwhelm...
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- tootie 6y agoThere's a difference between silencing dissent and silencing disinformation.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- hda2 6y agoWho gets to decide what's disinformation?
- h_spacer 6y agoThe leader of course. And we know she is good because all the news media say she is good. And we know the news media is good because she tells us it is good. Welcome to Hotel California, you can check out at any time, but you can never leave.
- tootie 6y agoWe don't need cosmic deity levels of certainty. Most first-world judicial systems are predicated on the standard of evidence being "reasonable". As in "reasonable cause to believe" or "beyond a reasonable doubt". We have functioned pretty well with based on "reasonable" and we can apply that same standard here. It is fair to label a statement as at least misinformation if it seems to be untrue beyond a reasonable doubt. Disinformation requires intent which is much harder to determine but not really relevant.
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y agoBut Brutus says he was ambitious; And Brutus is an honourable man.
- azernik 6y agoThe point of having a critical media is that the electorate can actually punish their leaders for bad things. Leaving those leaders in place because criticism is actually good defeats the point.
- Andrew_nenakhov 6y agoYou missed the point. It was about media being equally critical to all leaders, not selectively.
- dxdm 6y ago> equally critical to all leaders Not all leaders do things the same way, and there might be more cause to criticize one over the others. It should be _possible_ to publish criticism for all; that doesn't mean there should be equal amounts of criticism. Otherwise, you could have one administration that mishandles a lot of thing complain that they were treated unfairly, just because they're rightfully criticized for their shortcomings. (Which it looks like has been happening recently.) The question is, though, what happens if one side keeps knowingly publishing baseless allegations to stir up fear and mistrust.
- azernik 6y agoThey should absolutely be critical selectively, based on the actual performance of that leader. The point of the criticism is to provide a deterrent to oppression and mismanagement, and a deterrent doesn't work if it's applied without regard to its target's actions.
- pqhwan 6y agoSo we should vote for leaders that “the media” hates and scrutinizes? That is a sad, cynical view of the world. Also, you realize that the media in the US includes outlets on both sides, right? As in, every leader pretty much fits both characterizations?
- Cthulhu_ 6y agoHow is that an unpopular opinion though? Even the right-wingers keep hammering about fake news, which implies they care about fair, neutral and 'true' news. I mean it's one of those doublespeak terms that they themselves don't fully understand (apparently), but still.
- MeinBlutIstBlau 6y agoI have yet to meet a reddit democrat that knows more about Obama than they do about Trump. That's why I thought Trump should've been in office again. Now we've got a dying old man and a pro cop VP.