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I think you're attributing too much credit to California. > Highly talented employees The vast majority of Tesla's "talented" employees came from out of state

I think you're attributing too much credit to California. > Highly talented employees The vast majority of Tesla's "talented" employees came from out of state. Regardless of that, I don't understand the perspective that employment is an act of "taking from the state". Tesla pays above-market salaries. Isn't it, then, more accurate to view employment as Tesla giving back/helping to the community? > Progressive policies that CA built for clean technology I assume the policies you're referencing are the tax credits for solar installation and EV purchases. Aren't these credits independent of where the company is located? If so, Tesla would have been able to take advantage regardless of their location. > Let's call this what it is - he doesn't want to pay a large tax bill for the success that he has had (hence selling all property in CA) It seems reasonable to assume that his tax bill and California policies were both factors in his decision to move. What makes you so confident that the tax bill is the primary factor? Do you have some inside knowledge? If I were in his shoes, I'd be optimizing for Tesla's success, not my personal taxes. He's already wildly rich, and it's pretty clear to me that he's not doing this for the money.

boringg 6y ago
(1) Tesla actually used to pay below market rate (bay area) and had incredibly demanding working conditions (see drive from Elon carries through the company and that it was a mission based company) for a good period of time. I'm not saying thats good or bad just that they weren't paying above-market. Not sure what the calculus is now that the equity value has gone right off the charts. (2) No you get additional benefits for being in-state manufacturers. (I think its 10% vs 30% in state off capital costs). Referring to in-state policies not the federal ITC tax credit. (3) Not that he would want to spend that money on himself but he would want to put that capital to good use elsewhere. If he doesn't believe the state to be a good deployer of capital he probably doesn't want to give them a large portion of capital at his expense. Less about himself spending lavishly then putting his hard earned capital to waste (one way of looking at it).
- fairity 6y ago
  > No you get additional benefits for being in-state manufacturers. (I think its 10% vs 30% in state off capital costs). Can you link me to a source that explains the additional benefits that in-state EV manufacturers accrue? Thanks!
  - boringg 6y ago
    I'm talking solar and storage in this case. See CPUC's SGIP program (https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/sgip/ https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/sgip/).
    - fairity 6y ago
      Got it. After looking into the details, it seems like Tesla received around ~$111M of additional benefit from SGIP due to being in-state. $111M isn't nothing, but I'm doubtful this is a big factor in Tesla's success. In-state incentive explanation: https://energycenter.org/sites/default/files/docs/nav/buildings/businesses/sgip/docs/Approved%20CA%20Suppliers%206_28_13.pdf https://energycenter.org/sites/default/files/docs/nav/buildi... SGIP program budget here: https://www.selfgenca.com/budget_public/program_level_summary/statewide https://www.selfgenca.com/budget_public/program_level_summar... In total, SGIP has issued $841M of incentives. SolarCity's market share is ~20%. The in-state incentive grants an additional 20%. $841M * .2 *.66 = 111M
      - boringg 6y ago
        There’s a bunch of other programs as well. I think la times did a write up in the past. There’s the california solar initiative, an california ev program as well. Would love to have the time to run this all down for you but frankly kids + life in general doesn’t allow for that... Edit: not the best source but has some of the govt programs www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hy-musk-subsidies-20150531-story.html%3f_amp=true I find it tough to imagine Tesla pulling off its trajectory in any other state from the early days. He’s had some good tailwinds from the state until this spring.

boringg 6y ago

(1) Tesla actually used to pay below market rate (bay area) and had incredibly demanding working conditions (see drive from Elon carries through the company and that it was a mission based company) for a good period of time. I'm not saying thats good or bad just that they weren't paying above-market. Not sure what the calculus is now that the equity value has gone right off the charts. (2) No you get additional benefits for being in-state manufacturers. (I think its 10% vs 30% in state off capital costs). Referring to in-state policies not the federal ITC tax credit. (3) Not that he would want to spend that money on himself but he would want to put that capital to good use elsewhere. If he doesn't believe the state to be a good deployer of capital he probably doesn't want to give them a large portion of capital at his expense. Less about himself spending lavishly then putting his hard earned capital to waste (one way of looking at it).

fairity 6y ago
> No you get additional benefits for being in-state manufacturers. (I think its 10% vs 30% in state off capital costs). Can you link me to a source that explains the additional benefits that in-state EV manufacturers accrue? Thanks!
- boringg 6y ago
  I'm talking solar and storage in this case. See CPUC's SGIP program (https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/sgip/ https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/sgip/).
  - fairity 6y ago
    Got it. After looking into the details, it seems like Tesla received around ~$111M of additional benefit from SGIP due to being in-state. $111M isn't nothing, but I'm doubtful this is a big factor in Tesla's success. In-state incentive explanation: https://energycenter.org/sites/default/files/docs/nav/buildings/businesses/sgip/docs/Approved%20CA%20Suppliers%206_28_13.pdf https://energycenter.org/sites/default/files/docs/nav/buildi... SGIP program budget here: https://www.selfgenca.com/budget_public/program_level_summary/statewide https://www.selfgenca.com/budget_public/program_level_summar... In total, SGIP has issued $841M of incentives. SolarCity's market share is ~20%. The in-state incentive grants an additional 20%. $841M * .2 *.66 = 111M
    - boringg 6y ago
      There’s a bunch of other programs as well. I think la times did a write up in the past. There’s the california solar initiative, an california ev program as well. Would love to have the time to run this all down for you but frankly kids + life in general doesn’t allow for that... Edit: not the best source but has some of the govt programs www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hy-musk-subsidies-20150531-story.html%3f_amp=true I find it tough to imagine Tesla pulling off its trajectory in any other state from the early days. He’s had some good tailwinds from the state until this spring.