3 ms·

Why are LEOs so drawn to authoritarianism? Do they not understand their role as a vanguard against tyranny?

GoblinSlayer 6y ago
Against tyranny of their leader?
moate 6y ago
No, and I don't think anyone sees them this way (the same way "free speech" loving Republicans wouldn't consider themselves "liberals"). The police are almost always tools of authoritarianism. They act as, well, authority figures when it comes to who is a criminal, which allows for so much abuse. Most courts basically take it for granted that if a cop and a civilian say opposing things, if there is no other evidence the cop is to be the trusted figure.
dragonwriter 6y ago
> Why are LEOs so drawn to authoritarianism? You are reversing cause and effect; people who are drawn to authoritarianism are disproportionately drawn to law enforcement, where they have a protected position from which to exert their authoritarian impulses. > Do they not understand their role as a vanguard against tyranny? Many of them do enough to use it to justify their own authoritarianism, especially law enforcement leaders who tend to cite it as an excuse for their own arbitrary actions overriding or neglecting the law they are called on to enforce. Fewer seem to take it as more than an excuse for their own tyranny, though.
- Enginerrrd 6y ago
  As a counterpoint, this isn't always the case. My local sheriff has gone on record saying he will refuse to do things he believes are unconstitutional. It has come up. I'm actually a big fan. I really hate the "my hands are tied" attitude that leads to stupid things like children getting arrested by the school resource officer.
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    > As a counterpoint, this isn't always the case. Sure, X are disproprotionately inclined to become Y does not mean all X become Y, and even moreso does not mean all Y originated as X. (Though the exact statement you refer to is often used to justify arbitrary action by sheriffs, too.)
artificialLimbs 6y ago
Genuine question: how many of them do you think have ever thought about this? Thinking about it would also not necessarily result in the conclusion you want. Even they did think about this, a passing thought to the effect of "I should protect the people against tyranny rather than do what the boss says" is most often not enough to change a person's general disposition. This kind of benevolent action requires a person of moral character to begin with. I suspect (with no evidence) that it is often the case that they're just there to get a paycheck.
jmnicolas 6y ago
A psychiatrist once told me that the mental paths to become a criminal were exactly the same than to become a cop and the end result was mostly because of their previous life experience.
- ultrarunner 6y ago
  That would create a very interesting wrinkle in the "thin blue line" rhetoric.
  - Enginerrrd 6y ago
    Certainly gives the phrase a double meaning.
lkxijlewlf 6y ago
Incentives? Are there bonuses for solving crime?
SoSoRoCoCo 6y ago
Because it is not the responsibility of the police to protect you [1], [2]. Their primary job is to protect the wealth and power of certain classes by delivering punitive measures for all sorts of things (like morality crimes [3]) to keep the lower classes in line. Those upper classes want LEO to have every available tool in their power, regardless of legality. Even worse, LEO is now being infiltrated by militant partisans, so there is even more motivation for them to ignore laws. [4] [1] https://mises.org/power-market/police-have-no-duty-protect-you-federal-court-affirms-yet-again https://mises.org/power-market/police-have-no-duty-protect-y... [2] https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/no-special-duty https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/no-sp... [3] https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/ https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/ [4] https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/09/oath-keepers-far-right-group-infiltrate-local-government-texas-443773 https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/09/oath-keepe...
ubermonkey 6y ago
Oh, you sweet, summer child. LEOs are by definition authoritarians.

Against tyranny of their leader?

No, and I don't think anyone sees them this way (the same way "free speech" loving Republicans wouldn't consider themselves "liberals"). The police are almost always tools of authoritarianism. They act as, well, authority figures when it comes to who is a criminal, which allows for so much abuse. Most courts basically take it for granted that if a cop and a civilian say opposing things, if there is no other evidence the cop is to be the trusted figure.

dragonwriter 6y ago

> Why are LEOs so drawn to authoritarianism? You are reversing cause and effect; people who are drawn to authoritarianism are disproportionately drawn to law enforcement, where they have a protected position from which to exert their authoritarian impulses. > Do they not understand their role as a vanguard against tyranny? Many of them do enough to use it to justify their own authoritarianism, especially law enforcement leaders who tend to cite it as an excuse for their own arbitrary actions overriding or neglecting the law they are called on to enforce. Fewer seem to take it as more than an excuse for their own tyranny, though.

Enginerrrd 6y ago
As a counterpoint, this isn't always the case. My local sheriff has gone on record saying he will refuse to do things he believes are unconstitutional. It has come up. I'm actually a big fan. I really hate the "my hands are tied" attitude that leads to stupid things like children getting arrested by the school resource officer.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > As a counterpoint, this isn't always the case. Sure, X are disproprotionately inclined to become Y does not mean all X become Y, and even moreso does not mean all Y originated as X. (Though the exact statement you refer to is often used to justify arbitrary action by sheriffs, too.)

artificialLimbs 6y ago

Genuine question: how many of them do you think have ever thought about this? Thinking about it would also not necessarily result in the conclusion you want. Even they did think about this, a passing thought to the effect of "I should protect the people against tyranny rather than do what the boss says" is most often not enough to change a person's general disposition. This kind of benevolent action requires a person of moral character to begin with. I suspect (with no evidence) that it is often the case that they're just there to get a paycheck.

jmnicolas 6y ago

A psychiatrist once told me that the mental paths to become a criminal were exactly the same than to become a cop and the end result was mostly because of their previous life experience.

ultrarunner 6y ago
That would create a very interesting wrinkle in the "thin blue line" rhetoric.
- Enginerrrd 6y ago
  Certainly gives the phrase a double meaning.

lkxijlewlf 6y ago

Incentives? Are there bonuses for solving crime?

SoSoRoCoCo 6y ago

Because it is not the responsibility of the police to protect you [1], [2]. Their primary job is to protect the wealth and power of certain classes by delivering punitive measures for all sorts of things (like morality crimes [3]) to keep the lower classes in line. Those upper classes want LEO to have every available tool in their power, regardless of legality. Even worse, LEO is now being infiltrated by militant partisans, so there is even more motivation for them to ignore laws. [4] [1] https://mises.org/power-market/police-have-no-duty-protect-you-federal-court-affirms-yet-again https://mises.org/power-market/police-have-no-duty-protect-y... [2] https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/no-special-duty https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/no-sp... [3] https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/ https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/ [4] https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/09/oath-keepers-far-right-group-infiltrate-local-government-texas-443773 https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/12/09/oath-keepe...

ubermonkey 6y ago

Oh, you sweet, summer child. LEOs are by definition authoritarians.