4 ms·

I feel like this would be way more involved and many individuals have better more verifiable alibis with the things listed. Like I'm sure there will be drawback

by danaur 6y ago

I feel like this would be way more involved and many individuals have better more verifiable alibis with the things listed. Like I'm sure there will be drawback cases but it is seems in aggregate that this stuff is generally positive. Thoughts?

dvdkhlng 6y ago
I think you are too optimistic WRT how forensic "science" is generally applied in the US [1] (one prominent example is e.g. [2]). Now imagine this is you standing in front of a scientifically untrained jury trying to argue against junk-science presented by a "forensic expert" testimonial. Not sure an alibi is going to help you much in that case. [1] https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/09/why-forensic-science-is-in-crisis-and-how-we-can-fix-it/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/09/why-forensic-science-... [2] https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2009-08-25-chi-090825willingham-story.html https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2009-08-25-chi-09...
- lotsofpulp 6y ago
  That's why you keep Google location history on at all times, and also post photos to Instagram/Facebook as much as you can so you have timestamped records of photos of what you were doing at all times.
  - fidelramos 6y ago
    That sure sounds like a dystopia to me, reads like a Black Mirror episode.
    - dvdkhlng 6y ago
      Also with the advent of deep fakes [1] I'm not so sure that this is going to be a winning strategy for long. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepfake https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepfake
      - lotsofpulp 6y ago
        That’s exactly why you would need Facebook or Google or your mobile network operator or all of them to serve as proof of your alibi. If the finger is pointed at you with a deep fake, you can then counter with proof from large corporations which presumably haven’t all been compromised. You might also be able to use proof of your location in other settings, such as civil suits or domestic disputes. Lots of people are using dash cams in a similar fashion. Proof to protect themselves from being named the liable party in a collision. Same with forcing communications over email so you can prove what was actually communicated in the event a legal or public relations matter arises.
  - daniellarusso 6y ago
    To make you a suspect? https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/google-tracked-his-bike-ride-past-burglarized-home-made-him-n1151761 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/google-tracked-his-bike...
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      No, to defend yourself just like the guy in your article did: > Even then, Kenyon wanted to make sure police didn’t have lingering doubts about McCoy, whom they still knew only as “John Doe.” So he met with the detective again and showed him screenshots of his client’s Google location history, including data recorded by RunKeeper. The maps showed months of bike rides past the burglarized home. I’m posting kind of tongue in cheek, because it’s almost a foregone conclusion that people have their mobile device on them, which means the mobile networks know where you are at all times. In that event, it’s more advantageous for you to have access to your location history (via Google/Facebook/Instagram) when the full force or the law starts coming down on you.
  - rootsudo 6y ago
    It's horrible, but it's true, thankfully you can't forge phone history, or time posts to happen at a future time. Right?
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      I’m assuming a very, very small number of people worldwide can edit a time stamp on Facebook or google’s computers.
      - dvdkhlng 6y ago
        But everybody can give his/her smartphone to a 3rd party to carry around, right? Your Google location history only proves where your phone was, it doen't prove where you were.
        lotsofpulp 6y ago
        That’s why you have to combine it with selfies and whatnot on Instagram and/or Twitter, preferably in front of identifiable landmarks or storefronts.
        dvdkhlng 6y ago
        You mean you're using online services to provide you with trusted timestamp? [1]. But you need to consider how a trusted timestamp merely proves that some photo was definitely taking at or before the attested time. It does not prove that a photo was not actually taken a day earlier and then merely submitted at the attested time. To prove something was not recorded earlier is a little trickier. Need something like a newspaper headline that would not have been available earlier. And then how do you defend against claims that you took the photo early, but photoshopped the newspaper headline at the time it was attested? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping
        lotsofpulp 6y ago

by danaur 6y ago

dvdkhlng 6y ago

I think you are too optimistic WRT how forensic "science" is generally applied in the US [1] (one prominent example is e.g. [2]). Now imagine this is you standing in front of a scientifically untrained jury trying to argue against junk-science presented by a "forensic expert" testimonial. Not sure an alibi is going to help you much in that case. [1] https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/09/why-forensic-science-is-in-crisis-and-how-we-can-fix-it/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/09/why-forensic-science-... [2] https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2009-08-25-chi-090825willingham-story.html https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2009-08-25-chi-09...

lotsofpulp 6y ago
That's why you keep Google location history on at all times, and also post photos to Instagram/Facebook as much as you can so you have timestamped records of photos of what you were doing at all times.
- fidelramos 6y ago
  That sure sounds like a dystopia to me, reads like a Black Mirror episode.
  - dvdkhlng 6y ago
    Also with the advent of deep fakes [1] I'm not so sure that this is going to be a winning strategy for long. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepfake https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepfake
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      That’s exactly why you would need Facebook or Google or your mobile network operator or all of them to serve as proof of your alibi. If the finger is pointed at you with a deep fake, you can then counter with proof from large corporations which presumably haven’t all been compromised. You might also be able to use proof of your location in other settings, such as civil suits or domestic disputes. Lots of people are using dash cams in a similar fashion. Proof to protect themselves from being named the liable party in a collision. Same with forcing communications over email so you can prove what was actually communicated in the event a legal or public relations matter arises.
- daniellarusso 6y ago
  To make you a suspect? https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/google-tracked-his-bike-ride-past-burglarized-home-made-him-n1151761 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/google-tracked-his-bike...
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    No, to defend yourself just like the guy in your article did: > Even then, Kenyon wanted to make sure police didn’t have lingering doubts about McCoy, whom they still knew only as “John Doe.” So he met with the detective again and showed him screenshots of his client’s Google location history, including data recorded by RunKeeper. The maps showed months of bike rides past the burglarized home. I’m posting kind of tongue in cheek, because it’s almost a foregone conclusion that people have their mobile device on them, which means the mobile networks know where you are at all times. In that event, it’s more advantageous for you to have access to your location history (via Google/Facebook/Instagram) when the full force or the law starts coming down on you.
- rootsudo 6y ago
  It's horrible, but it's true, thankfully you can't forge phone history, or time posts to happen at a future time. Right?
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    I’m assuming a very, very small number of people worldwide can edit a time stamp on Facebook or google’s computers.
    - dvdkhlng 6y ago
      But everybody can give his/her smartphone to a 3rd party to carry around, right? Your Google location history only proves where your phone was, it doen't prove where you were.
      - lotsofpulp 6y ago
        That’s why you have to combine it with selfies and whatnot on Instagram and/or Twitter, preferably in front of identifiable landmarks or storefronts.
        dvdkhlng 6y ago
        You mean you're using online services to provide you with trusted timestamp? [1]. But you need to consider how a trusted timestamp merely proves that some photo was definitely taking at or before the attested time. It does not prove that a photo was not actually taken a day earlier and then merely submitted at the attested time. To prove something was not recorded earlier is a little trickier. Need something like a newspaper headline that would not have been available earlier. And then how do you defend against claims that you took the photo early, but photoshopped the newspaper headline at the time it was attested? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping
        lotsofpulp 6y ago