4 ms·

> I've tried to eat out more often, even leaving less or no tips in order to feel more incentivized to not eat at home. If you live in the US this is a real je

> I've tried to eat out more often, even leaving less or no tips in order to feel more incentivized to not eat at home. If you live in the US this is a real jerk move. You're talking about how you're getting richer, but then aren't willing to tip the service worker making less than minimum wage?

gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago
I don't agree. I don't like tipping and so I do not eat out usually because of this. Right now I understand that we need to do our part to help small businesses, so I'm making an effort and tricking my brain into eating out by not tipping. This is where I want to put my money: I think it's my responsibility if small businesses are going to survive, I don't think it's my responsibility if workers are not paid well.
- alistairSH 6y ago
  I don't like tipping and so I do not eat out usually because of this. This doesn't really make sense. Without tipping (expected nationally), the cost of labor would just have to be priced directly into the food. Instead of a $15 burger, it would be $20. If you don't like to spend money on dining out, fine, but it has little to do with tipping and more to do with being frugal.
  - ketamine__ 6y ago
    > This doesn't really make sense. Without tipping (expected nationally), the cost of labor would just have to be priced directly into the food. Instead of a $15 burger, it would be $20. So basically it does make sense because it is easier if the price is the total cost.
  - gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago
    I disagree, tipping is stupid because it is based on percentages. Why should I give more tip because I bought a more expensive item? Sorry but we don't have to agree, forcing tipping on others is an asshole move.
- majormajor 6y ago
  Why do you value the small business owner more than the small business employee?
  - minikites 6y ago
    One of the reasons some people visit restaurants is to feel powerful in relation to their server and a big part of that is making them "perform" for a good tip.
  - gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago
    I value the employee, I think they'll do fine with minimum wages, but they won't do fine if the small business goes down.
- Alupis 6y ago
  You say you don't eat out because you don't like tipping - and that businesses should just pay their employees more so you don't have to tip. OK fine - but doesn't that just result in a meal costing what it does now + tip? How is that any different? Actually, it would cost more than just standard price + tip as you funnel the money into the business first before it hits the employee's bank account. > Right now I understand that we need to do our part to help small businesses, so I'm making an effort and tricking my brain into eating out by not tipping This logic is absurd. Both small businesses and employees of small businesses are being crushed right now. Support them both or don't use their services. You deciding to eat out is consuming time from the wait staff (who often tips out bussers and kitchen staff too). That time could have been spent serving another table that decides to tip. You are literally taking money away from small business employees by continuing this behavior. You are punishing them for serving you a meal. How is that appropriate?
- learc83 6y ago
  Tipping severs is the way our society works. By eating at table service restaurant you are implying that you are going to pay the server despite the fact that you have no intention to do so. It’s no different than your manager dicking you around by saying you’ll probably get a raise if you work overtime despite having no intention to do so. Rationalize all you want, but you’re acting like a huge asshole. If you are morally opposed to tipping, eat takeout or at a counter serve restaurant.
cgriswald 6y ago
No service working in the United States is making less than minimum wage unless their employer is breaking the law regardless of whether you tip.
- alistairSH 6y ago
  True. The wages laws that govern service staff is generally written as a conditional, where the employee earns the greater of: 1. Standard minimum wage 2. Some value less than minimum wage + tips If the employee doesn't break minimum wage by adding their wage+tips, the employer has to make them whole. And then likely cut their hours and force them to look for other work.
  - minikites 6y ago
    >the employer has to make them whole No they don't, because what are you going to do about it? Hire a lawyer on your minimum wage salary (assuming you even know you're getting cheated)?
    - cgriswald 6y ago
      Every employee in the United States can file complaints with their state labor board and the U.S. Department of Labor Wage and Hour Division.
      - minikites 6y ago
        If this is both true and effective, why is wage theft still extremely prevalent?
        kube-system 6y ago
        Because people who are in a position to be earning those kinds of wages heavily correlate with other situational factors (social, educational, legal, etc.) which may prevent them from reporting the violations. And, the employers who tend to engage in wage theft are generally small businesses, which there are a ton of.
FpUser 6y ago
Taking care of their employees should be a business of their employer. They should not transfer their problems over to me: a customer. Sure I can tip if someone did an extraordinary job and impressed me but the last thing I should have on my mind is that If I do not tip then the person would go hungry.
- minikites 6y ago
  That's an admirable goal, but it is manifestly untrue in the present-day USA.

gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago

I don't agree. I don't like tipping and so I do not eat out usually because of this. Right now I understand that we need to do our part to help small businesses, so I'm making an effort and tricking my brain into eating out by not tipping. This is where I want to put my money: I think it's my responsibility if small businesses are going to survive, I don't think it's my responsibility if workers are not paid well.

alistairSH 6y ago
I don't like tipping and so I do not eat out usually because of this. This doesn't really make sense. Without tipping (expected nationally), the cost of labor would just have to be priced directly into the food. Instead of a $15 burger, it would be $20. If you don't like to spend money on dining out, fine, but it has little to do with tipping and more to do with being frugal.
- ketamine__ 6y ago
  > This doesn't really make sense. Without tipping (expected nationally), the cost of labor would just have to be priced directly into the food. Instead of a $15 burger, it would be $20. So basically it does make sense because it is easier if the price is the total cost.
- gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago
  I disagree, tipping is stupid because it is based on percentages. Why should I give more tip because I bought a more expensive item? Sorry but we don't have to agree, forcing tipping on others is an asshole move.
majormajor 6y ago
Why do you value the small business owner more than the small business employee?
- minikites 6y ago
  One of the reasons some people visit restaurants is to feel powerful in relation to their server and a big part of that is making them "perform" for a good tip.
- gtrhtrhtrhtr 6y ago
  I value the employee, I think they'll do fine with minimum wages, but they won't do fine if the small business goes down.
Alupis 6y ago
You say you don't eat out because you don't like tipping - and that businesses should just pay their employees more so you don't have to tip. OK fine - but doesn't that just result in a meal costing what it does now + tip? How is that any different? Actually, it would cost more than just standard price + tip as you funnel the money into the business first before it hits the employee's bank account. > Right now I understand that we need to do our part to help small businesses, so I'm making an effort and tricking my brain into eating out by not tipping This logic is absurd. Both small businesses and employees of small businesses are being crushed right now. Support them both or don't use their services. You deciding to eat out is consuming time from the wait staff (who often tips out bussers and kitchen staff too). That time could have been spent serving another table that decides to tip. You are literally taking money away from small business employees by continuing this behavior. You are punishing them for serving you a meal. How is that appropriate?
learc83 6y ago
Tipping severs is the way our society works. By eating at table service restaurant you are implying that you are going to pay the server despite the fact that you have no intention to do so. It’s no different than your manager dicking you around by saying you’ll probably get a raise if you work overtime despite having no intention to do so. Rationalize all you want, but you’re acting like a huge asshole. If you are morally opposed to tipping, eat takeout or at a counter serve restaurant.

cgriswald 6y ago

No service working in the United States is making less than minimum wage unless their employer is breaking the law regardless of whether you tip.

alistairSH 6y ago
True. The wages laws that govern service staff is generally written as a conditional, where the employee earns the greater of: 1. Standard minimum wage 2. Some value less than minimum wage + tips If the employee doesn't break minimum wage by adding their wage+tips, the employer has to make them whole. And then likely cut their hours and force them to look for other work.
- minikites 6y ago
  >the employer has to make them whole No they don't, because what are you going to do about it? Hire a lawyer on your minimum wage salary (assuming you even know you're getting cheated)?
  - cgriswald 6y ago
    Every employee in the United States can file complaints with their state labor board and the U.S. Department of Labor Wage and Hour Division.
    - minikites 6y ago
      If this is both true and effective, why is wage theft still extremely prevalent?
      - kube-system 6y ago
        Because people who are in a position to be earning those kinds of wages heavily correlate with other situational factors (social, educational, legal, etc.) which may prevent them from reporting the violations. And, the employers who tend to engage in wage theft are generally small businesses, which there are a ton of.

FpUser 6y ago

Taking care of their employees should be a business of their employer. They should not transfer their problems over to me: a customer. Sure I can tip if someone did an extraordinary job and impressed me but the last thing I should have on my mind is that If I do not tip then the person would go hungry.

minikites 6y ago
That's an admirable goal, but it is manifestly untrue in the present-day USA.