6 ms·
I'd love to hear from people who want to stay in the Bay area what is unique that you cannot find elsewhere in cheaper locales. I lived in Mountain View for 3
by AndrewKemendo 6y ago
I'd love to hear from people who want to stay in the Bay area what is unique that you cannot find elsewhere in cheaper locales.
I lived in Mountain View for 3 months during 500 startups and the valley proper was the most garden variety suburban existence you could find anywhere.
I lived in SF proper off and on and can attest that it certainly has (had?) fantastic restaurants/shops and a particular type of culture that many people love. However the basic infrastructure and problems with SF are well known and have been documented.
I can't see at this point how the former plusses of SF outweigh the latter negatives and frankly I see no inherent plusses to the Valley.
It seems that people (technologists mostly) literally only value the valley because of technology companies and even more pointedly - because that's where the big VC money lives.
- kilbuz 6y agoFor me (in SF): climate that matches what I want perfectly. The option for snow or beaches on the same day. The food, the diversity, the grittiness, the jobs, the history. And all my family lives here, too. The biggest one of all: walkability, never having to get in my car unless I want to leave the city. Where did you end up moving that you found a better fit for yourself?
- AndrewKemendo 6y agoNorthern Virginia about an Hour from DC. The only two things you miss in VA on your list is "grittiness" which is a negative for me, and walkability, which you could get if you go closer to DC.
- kilbuz 6y agoAnd the family, which is maybe the biggest draw for many of us. The more I think about it, the more I realize the choice of where you live is barely rational, if at all. Sure we come up with reason about why we are where we are post hoc, but are those the real reasons? I can almost guarantee I will never move to DC or Virginia. Not because it isn't an amazing place with everything you can want, but because it's just not me for some reason that's hard to articulate. I would guess you would almost guarantee you'd never move to CA, too.
- AndrewKemendo 6y agoYeah I think that nails it - in the sense that we both are right. SF/Bay Area is "Good enough" for your needs and VA is "Good enough" for mine and it's not some optimized process, moreso an artifact of our relative histories.
- gowld 6y agoClimate is also missing, which is huge. VA has hot humid summers and freezing cold winters. SF spring/fall all year round.
- TheCoelacanth 6y agoAs opposed to SF which has hot humid winters and freezing cold summers /s Not sure SF's climate can be considered universally better. I think I would get sick of it never actually getting warm.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- TuringNYC 6y agoSame as @AndrewKemendo I re-lo'd to Northern Virginia just outside DC, 3yrs ago in my case. This is my 3rd tour in DC/Va. It has been a fantastic three years, especially w/r/t life, friends, family, society. I bike to work, and every day has been wonderful. That said -- and I hear pushback on this from other threads -- my job opportunities here for any senior level roles are next to nil. This could be because I do not have a security clearance (a local favorite), or it could be because the job pyramid here in DC/NoVa really is differently shaped than SF/SV, or it could be that i'm an outsider w/o a deep social network, or perhaps I'm not looking at the area correctly. As an anecdote, I get tons of Linked In messages for opportunities in California. CTO positions, VP positions at venture backed growth startups, all across the board. I get almost no in-bounds from companies in DC except for consulting firms (been there, done that when i was 20-25, not sure if that is a good fit at my current stage in life.) I'm sure part of it is my profile. I have lots of real-time systems, model, quant, Computer Vision, and tech leadership background. I'm just not sure how much of a market there is for that -- though I'm positive having a security clearance would change things dramatically. This presents a serious concern for me, and a balancing act for continued happiness in DC/VA.
- residentfoam 6y agoIf I could, I'd leave tomorrow, but, besides tech, there is another unique aspect of Bay Area: the Biotech scene. My wife works in Biotech and the only other alternative for us would be the Boston area. But, after running some numbers pro/cons, the Bay Area wins. So we are stuck here ... for now.
- allcentury 6y agoDepends - Boston can be cheaper if you don't have a big commute and the public transportation can help. Source: I've lived in both.
- residentfoam 6y agoYeah I looked into home prices rent/buy. True that you can find something _cheaper_ but not cheap/good enough to justify the lower salary and less tech opportunities. I came to the conclusion that Boston is just as expensive as SF but with less opportunities.
- yeswecatan 6y agoPhilly is supposed to have an _ok_ biotech scene, so I hear.
- asdff 6y agoYou can work in biotech in any city on the west coast
- Bhilai 6y agoMy friends who don't want to leave SV are mostly singles and couples without kids who don't mind living in apartments for rest of their lives. They move to a new apartment/condo every 2-3 years and don't care about schools, community, public transport etc. Another set of friends were lucky enough to be able to purchase million and half dollar homes in Fremont/South San Jose/Milpitas/Campbell and now that they have friends and their kids have friends, they are "settled" and don't mind paying ridiculous mortgage for next 20ish years. They do complaint about having to wfh home from their garage since all rooms in their home are occupied with kids at home. My friends in SFBA who claim that there are many jobs opportunities in tech companies have not changed their jobs in ~5 years.
- cam0 6y agoI grew up in the Southeast and went to college there. I've since lived in Palo Alto and SF, and I'm staying in SF for the long haul. There aren't many things that are truly unique to any one city or region, but the reasons why I loved Palo Alto and currently love SF include: 1. the intelligent, interesting, generally well-mannered, and equally laid-back and hardworking people. 2. the weather (heat and humidity are hell to me) - I'm a runner and a cyclist and I love being able to do those things every day of the year in comfort. 3. beautiful nature in my backyard - Golden Gate Park, the Presidio, Mt. Tam, the Berkeley hills, Ocean Beach, day trips to Sonoma, weekend trips to Tahoe, weekend trips to Big Sur, proximity to Yosemite. 4. the walkability of my neighborhood (I live in a nice neighborhood with clean streets and rarely encounter any homelessness - I've still never actually seen a needle anywhere). My favorite sushi restaurant is one block away, 5 craft coffee shops within 3 blocks, Whole Foods within walking distance, multiple restaurants (all of these I have in mind are still open). 5. Biden/Harris flags and bumper stickers everywhere - maybe I enjoy an echo chamber but after spending considerable time in the Southeast, I love being in a solid blue city.
- jonny_eh 6y agoI have a wife and young child and plan to stay long term. Both my wife and I work in tech, and are not fans of remote work. So for both of us this is the best place career-wise. We own a modest house, with a nice yard, so no complaints there. We love the food, nature, weather, and theatre scene. We're in San Mateo, walking distance from downtown, which means we have access to some of the best ramen outside of Japan. To be perfectly honest, the only thing missing is our friends and family in Canada. It wasn't so bad when we could visit 2-3 times a year, but the pandemic has put a stop to that.
- throwaway987978 6y agoWhat's your favourite ramen restaurants? My wife is Japanese and she hasn't found anything that rivals Japan yet.
- jonny_eh 6y agoMy top picks are Ramen Parlor or Ramen Dojo.
- scarmig 6y ago1) SF & Valley: Education levels of the people here. You can get that in a couple other places--DC, NYC, Boston--but not too many others. Relatedly, two easily accessible world class universities are in the Bay Area: Boston beats us here, but we beat NYC and DC. 2) SF & Valley: Diversity. Bay Area cities top the list of largest number of foreign born residents, with only LA and NYC being competitive. 3) SF & Valley: Weather. LA beats us here, but SF trounces NYC, Boston, DC, and Seattle. 4) Just SF: Walkability and street life. SF is more walkable than most cities (the weather helps with that), and although it has shitty public transit options, it's only shitty in comparison to places with actual good public transit, which more or less don't exist in the US. 5) Just SF: Weirdness. Okay, SF has driven out most of the interesting weirdo and artistic crowds and replaced them with CrossFitting Burners. But there are still remnants of that culture, more so than most places except perhaps NYC. 6) SF & Valley: Food. It's mediocre in comparison to the scenes in LA and NYC. But it's still worlds better than the rest of the country. 7) SF: Arts. Similar to food, it's mediocre compared to LA and NYC. But it's still worlds better than the rest of the country. 8) SF & Valley: Nature. West Coast cities are all competitive here, as is Denver/Boulder (though even they lack the beaches), but this is another place where East Coast cities fall short. In the end, the only plausibly competitive cities on this scoring matrix are LA and NYC. LA sacrifices a lot of the walkability and weirdness of SF. NYC sacrifices the weather, and moving to NYC from SF isn't going to get you of any the much vaunted coupon-cutting decrease in cost of living that everyone in these comments is so pumped about. Just to be fair, I'll also list disadvantages of SF: 1) Cost of living. "No one is willing to pay that much to live in SF, it's too expensive." 2) Dating scene for men. 3) Travel. Subjective, but East Coast cities are better situated for international travel than the West Coast. 4) Cleanliness. Yep, SF is an unhygienic shithole in many places. 5) Monoculture. Too many tech folks here, not enough diversity in industry.
- rock_hard 6y agoAgree with all points except "Dating scene for men" As somebody who has lived on three continents in major metro area's as well as countryside IMO SFBA has the best dating scene. I am married now, so I have been out of the single pool for a couple years...but before that I will say that SFBA had the most attractive pool of available woman in the world, if intelligence, creativity, independence, being self starters and physical attractiveness is what you value. I sure found the love of my life here.
- sfblah 6y agoI live in the Oakland hills. The access to SF via Bart in 30 minutes and the access to completely open space to go running, hiking, biking, etc. is pretty unusual. Look up the EBMUD land east of Oakland for a reference. It's unbelievably large. This connection between nature and city is really unusual.
- gnicholas 6y agoI'm tied to Stanford (by marriage), so we won't be leaving for decades. If it weren't for the university connection, I would certainly be thinking about different options, even though all of our family is in northern California.
- abeppu 6y agoI'm in SF. I think I'll stay for a while longer bc: - I enjoy not needing a car. Many neighborhoods are walkable. - I appreciate the mild weather. E.g. I lived in NYC, and though I did not need a car, humid summers and snowy winters made it less pleasant to be outside. - It's dense but not _too_ dense. NYC felt legitimately claustrophobic sometimes. - It's still an LGBT mecca. Prior to the pandemic, I could be in queer spaces on a daily basis. I don't know that I'll be in SF forever. But when I think of moving, I wonder where I would go, and what my life would look like when I get there. I grew up in suburbs and still associate those neighborhoods with isolation. Among US cities, it's hard to meet all of these.
- habosa 6y agoEvery city is special in its own way. Very few cities have anything truly irreplaceable, but it's a combination of small differences that make a city special. My two favorite cities in the US are San Francisco and Philadelphia. Many people hate those places with a passion. To each their own!
- tzatziki 6y agoWould you mind expanding on what parts you like about Philly and why? I’ve been thinking about moving there but don’t see it mentioned favorably too often.
- habosa 6y agoSure! Some things that come to mind in no order: * Food - an incredible an ever-changing restaurant scene, from cheesesteaks to 10-course tasting menus. And all much more affordable than fine dining in most US cities, plus free BYOB is extremely common. * Music / Sports - incredible music scene with major and minor venues of all kinds, and a professional sports team in all 4 major leagues with a passionate fanbase. * Size - neither a very large city (NYC) nor a very small city (Boston). Easy to get around, narrow streets make it very walkable. * Attitude - Philly people are just different. I'd describe it as a "warm hostility" :) but you'll find Philadelphians are very welcoming while also being brutally honest. * Diversity - there is no racial majority in Philly. It's about 40% white, 40% black, and 20% other. * Price - Philly is cheap!
- yeswecatan 6y agoMy wife's family is here. If not for that we would be in literally any other part of the country now, enjoying a decent-sized house with a yard.