4 ms·

Self promotion is a skill directly translated into $$$ in terms of raw compensation. It's one of the biggest blocks I see from developers who are otherwise qua

by Grimm1 6y ago

Self promotion is a skill directly translated into $$$ in terms of raw compensation. It's one of the biggest blocks I see from developers who are otherwise qualified for positions like that but they don't know how to advocate for themselves. There is a games element to hiring and you have to put aside the thoughts of it being gross because at the end of the day it's a major component in earning more which for most people is one of the reasons they work. I say this as a dev myself and not a recruiter.

alkonaut 6y ago
Yes but even if I did write the most fantastic article there is no amount of money that would make me use hash tags or promote myself on LinkedIn...
- NikolaNovak 6y ago
  That is a personal decision. It may or may not be a rational decision, but depends on short and long term goals, and one's self-awareness and self-honesty. It becomes very quickly a real-life game of "would you do X for Y money? ". Saying "I wouldn't use a linked in hashtag for $10k/year (25k a year? 100k a year?) " is a pretty strong principle.
  - alkonaut 6y ago
    I also do recruiting and I’d certainly treat hashtagged self-promotion on LinkedIn as a big negative.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - sjg007 6y ago
      What do you find effective?
      - alkonaut 6y ago
        A solid reputation among people I already know. Short of that, a good portfolio of prior work. good internet presence which shows how a person handles disagreement, conflict. This is why a small GitHub presence is extremely valuable. Not because I want to see people grind away at weekend work or have a full commit graph. Simply because you can hope to see people interact with others in e.g a bug report or PR. How did they behave when their PR was rejected or their bug report was dismissed? This obviously is a step beyond self promotion. At this point I’m already reviewing someone’s resume. So the question is perhaps how would you get noticed to begin with? How do you market yourself? I don’t know. Work? No better form of self promotion than doing a good job.
        cutemonster 6y ago
        > treat hashtagged self-promotion on LinkedIn as a big negative What don't you like about it? > how would you get noticed to begin with? - - - Thanks btw for writing about how you think about GitHub PR discussions etc. Btw i didn't post at all to LinkedIn at least not yet
        alkonaut 6y ago
        > What don't you like about it? Not sure. Something just seems off. Perhaps it's because you have a category of not-very-close friends on LinkedIn promoting themselves really hard and the correlation between people self-promoting in that very "LinkedIn fashion" and being a really big asshat seems strong. Anecdotal, but still.
    - NikolaNovak 6y ago
      Fair, but I did not read the parent post I replied to as whether hashtagging/self-promotion is effective/positive or ineffective/negative. I read it as: "Assuming hashtagging and self-promotion on LinkedIn was effective, I still would not do it no matter the money", and that's the interpretation I replied to - perhaps erroneously. In a broader discussion - it's all about the fit. I don't think there's a single advice, action, characteristic, attribute, or effort, that won't increase your chances with X% of employers/recruiters/HR and decrease your chances with Y% of employers/recruiters/HR. [FWIW, I personally have Linked In, it's my online resume, but I don't interact with platform in any other manner; Self-promoting posts are indeed a turn-off for me personally - but I'm neither actively seeking a new job nor promoting my business, so it'd be a bit of dishonest to claim that situational personal preference for a larger truth :]
Viliam1234 6y ago
Wrong lesson: "I have seen stupid and incompetent people do X to get prestigious roles and big salaries. As a smart and competent person with self-esteem, I would never do X, lest people accidentally think I am one of them." Right lesson: "If X can help even stupid and incompetent people get prestigious roles and big salaries, I wonder what it would do for a smart and competent person. Probably the same, only more of it."
- Grimm1 6y ago
  Yup exactly.
- sjg007 6y ago
  Ok but the incompetent people won’t last in the job so... it seems to be a negative loop. That and the hiring mgr can’t identify lemons.
  - solveit 6y ago
    Incompetent people can be remarkably successful in a job they can't do.
    - ThePowerOfFuet 6y ago
      Ah, I see you have experience in enterprise environments.
      - comprev 6y ago
        Plus the might have an interest in politics.
- zamalek 6y ago
  Also, all three of those hashtags don't exactly inspire job security. I would sooner make a living by playing blackjack than be employed in blockchain. Both iot and machine learning are the tail wagging the dog. You use a tech because it's appropriate, not because it's trending. The number of businesses trying to shoehorn ML into their sales deck is hilarious, I don't know how much my previous employer spent on continued failed attempts at that trend.

by Grimm1 6y ago

alkonaut 6y ago

Yes but even if I did write the most fantastic article there is no amount of money that would make me use hash tags or promote myself on LinkedIn...

NikolaNovak 6y ago
That is a personal decision. It may or may not be a rational decision, but depends on short and long term goals, and one's self-awareness and self-honesty. It becomes very quickly a real-life game of "would you do X for Y money? ". Saying "I wouldn't use a linked in hashtag for $10k/year (25k a year? 100k a year?) " is a pretty strong principle.
- alkonaut 6y ago
  I also do recruiting and I’d certainly treat hashtagged self-promotion on LinkedIn as a big negative.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - sjg007 6y ago
    What do you find effective?
    - alkonaut 6y ago
      A solid reputation among people I already know. Short of that, a good portfolio of prior work. good internet presence which shows how a person handles disagreement, conflict. This is why a small GitHub presence is extremely valuable. Not because I want to see people grind away at weekend work or have a full commit graph. Simply because you can hope to see people interact with others in e.g a bug report or PR. How did they behave when their PR was rejected or their bug report was dismissed? This obviously is a step beyond self promotion. At this point I’m already reviewing someone’s resume. So the question is perhaps how would you get noticed to begin with? How do you market yourself? I don’t know. Work? No better form of self promotion than doing a good job.
      - cutemonster 6y ago
        > treat hashtagged self-promotion on LinkedIn as a big negative What don't you like about it? > how would you get noticed to begin with? - - - Thanks btw for writing about how you think about GitHub PR discussions etc. Btw i didn't post at all to LinkedIn at least not yet
        alkonaut 6y ago
        > What don't you like about it? Not sure. Something just seems off. Perhaps it's because you have a category of not-very-close friends on LinkedIn promoting themselves really hard and the correlation between people self-promoting in that very "LinkedIn fashion" and being a really big asshat seems strong. Anecdotal, but still.
  - NikolaNovak 6y ago
    Fair, but I did not read the parent post I replied to as whether hashtagging/self-promotion is effective/positive or ineffective/negative. I read it as: "Assuming hashtagging and self-promotion on LinkedIn was effective, I still would not do it no matter the money", and that's the interpretation I replied to - perhaps erroneously. In a broader discussion - it's all about the fit. I don't think there's a single advice, action, characteristic, attribute, or effort, that won't increase your chances with X% of employers/recruiters/HR and decrease your chances with Y% of employers/recruiters/HR. [FWIW, I personally have Linked In, it's my online resume, but I don't interact with platform in any other manner; Self-promoting posts are indeed a turn-off for me personally - but I'm neither actively seeking a new job nor promoting my business, so it'd be a bit of dishonest to claim that situational personal preference for a larger truth :]

Viliam1234 6y ago

Wrong lesson: "I have seen stupid and incompetent people do X to get prestigious roles and big salaries. As a smart and competent person with self-esteem, I would never do X, lest people accidentally think I am one of them." Right lesson: "If X can help even stupid and incompetent people get prestigious roles and big salaries, I wonder what it would do for a smart and competent person. Probably the same, only more of it."

Grimm1 6y ago
Yup exactly.
sjg007 6y ago
Ok but the incompetent people won’t last in the job so... it seems to be a negative loop. That and the hiring mgr can’t identify lemons.
- solveit 6y ago
  Incompetent people can be remarkably successful in a job they can't do.
  - ThePowerOfFuet 6y ago
    Ah, I see you have experience in enterprise environments.
    - comprev 6y ago
      Plus the might have an interest in politics.
zamalek 6y ago
Also, all three of those hashtags don't exactly inspire job security. I would sooner make a living by playing blackjack than be employed in blockchain. Both iot and machine learning are the tail wagging the dog. You use a tech because it's appropriate, not because it's trending. The number of businesses trying to shoehorn ML into their sales deck is hilarious, I don't know how much my previous employer spent on continued failed attempts at that trend.