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> The most convincing argument for job guarantee over UBI I saw was plan jefes in argentina. The rest of your text seems to be an argument for UBI and against

> The most convincing argument for job guarantee over UBI I saw was plan jefes in argentina. The rest of your text seems to be an argument for UBI and against job guarantee. Is that first sentence what you meant?

pydry 6y ago
Yes. I don't really see how I was arguing in favor of UBI.
- enriquto 6y ago
  You wrote this: 1. a group of people were assured jobs 2. the job assurance was changed to a basic income, no need to work anymore 3. people still showed up to work errr... seems OK to me? It proves that even if there is an UBI most people will still work. The UBI is just a safety net that assures you do not die of exposure if you get to spend some time without working (for whatever reason). Your example proves that the UBI does not really distort the job market (except for the most shitty jobs, which is alright if they disappear). Also, your example proves that the existence of an UBI does not turn people lazy. All in all, your example is a great argument for the UBI!
  - pydry 6y ago
    If they'd skipped straight to UBI they likely wouldn't have done these jobs.
    - enriquto 6y ago
      But this is a hypothesis not actually supported by your example. A better example would be a case were the application of an UBI created negative effects in a society.
      - pydry 6y ago
        I'm not sure why you need to prove that it creates negative effects to say that there is a better option. Is UBI better than nothing? Probably quite a lot. Better than a JG? No, I don't think so. This story very much demonstrates that giving people jobs helping the community rather than just money is a better option. They were both productive and happier. So much so that they didn't want to stop. I'm sure the nature of the job probably had something to do with it. If these jobs were in call centers for debt collectors they probably would have quit en masse and been happy about it.

pydry 6y ago

Yes. I don't really see how I was arguing in favor of UBI.

enriquto 6y ago
You wrote this: 1. a group of people were assured jobs 2. the job assurance was changed to a basic income, no need to work anymore 3. people still showed up to work errr... seems OK to me? It proves that even if there is an UBI most people will still work. The UBI is just a safety net that assures you do not die of exposure if you get to spend some time without working (for whatever reason). Your example proves that the UBI does not really distort the job market (except for the most shitty jobs, which is alright if they disappear). Also, your example proves that the existence of an UBI does not turn people lazy. All in all, your example is a great argument for the UBI!
- pydry 6y ago
  If they'd skipped straight to UBI they likely wouldn't have done these jobs.
  - enriquto 6y ago
    But this is a hypothesis not actually supported by your example. A better example would be a case were the application of an UBI created negative effects in a society.
    - pydry 6y ago
      I'm not sure why you need to prove that it creates negative effects to say that there is a better option. Is UBI better than nothing? Probably quite a lot. Better than a JG? No, I don't think so. This story very much demonstrates that giving people jobs helping the community rather than just money is a better option. They were both productive and happier. So much so that they didn't want to stop. I'm sure the nature of the job probably had something to do with it. If these jobs were in call centers for debt collectors they probably would have quit en masse and been happy about it.