4 ms·

It's very odd, if someone nowadays called their language CSharpScript, they'd get slapped with a C&D

codetrotter 6y ago
Sun was literally in on it though? So it'd be like if whoever was announcing this hypothetical C#Script was doing so together with Microsoft..
m_st 6y ago
According to the interview with Eich linked above: "Bill Joy at Sun was the champion of it, which was very helpful because that’s how we got the name." Sure helps :-)
astura 6y ago
Netscape had permission from Sun to use the "Java" name, it was a partnership. This press release itself even says it in the first sentence >Netscape Communications Corporation (NASDAQ: NSCP) and Sun Microsystems, Inc. (NASDAQ:SUNW), today announced JavaScript
acdha 6y ago
This was voluntary. You have to remember that at the time the residing hype kings were the so-called 4GLs (e.g. Clarion, Clipper, PowerBuilder) and things like Visual Basic, Pascal (Delphi), etc. so Sun and Netscape were trying to present this as the pair of languages which you used to build the web, which was already emerging as the white-hot new thing starting to transform the world.
- ajuc 6y ago
  Such a shame Clipper and Delphi didn't worked out. In early 90s my uncle (now 60 years old electrical engineer) taught himself clipper from 0 (no programming background whatsoever, and no English language) and wrote a software for capturing and analysing temperature curves of polymer ovens at a factory where he works that is still used to this day. They keep a DOS PC just to run it :) I don't think it's possible to do this with modern programming technology, there's too many layers of abstraction and unrelated asides blocking people from "just making it work".
  - 725686 6y ago
    My older brother still maintains clipper code that is used in production.
  - pjmlp 6y ago
    Delphi is still around, and there is a striving community in Germany, big enough to keep conferences and magazines going. But yeah, Borland really messed up.
bluedino 6y ago
Nobody outside of developers knows what C# is, though. Java was one of the biggest buzzwords of the late 90's.
- identity0 6y ago
  That's true, it's more like naming your language "BlockchainScript". I could totally see someone doing that today.
  - JackFr 6y ago
    "Scrypto"
  - cozzyd 6y ago
    I just checked and bitcoinscript.org seems to be owned by a domain parker.
    - Arnavion 6y ago
      Bitcoin already has a script (it's what transactions are made of) so that's not unexpected.
jen20 6y ago
scripts [1] suggests this has not been the case! [1]: https://github.com/scriptcs/scriptcs https://github.com/scriptcs/scriptcs
hajile 6y ago
Everything was fine because Sun owned the Javascript trademark. Oracle now owns that trademark today https://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=75026640&caseType=SERIAL_NO&searchType=statusSearch https://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=75026640&caseType=SERIAL_... For what it's worth, Microsoft lost a lawsuit over their Java clone called J. Their Javascript clone was called JScript. They made .net and C# instead and probably would have tried to make a new web language except that there was no room. One could argue that that VB.net was that language to some degree.
- ojosilva 6y ago
  In fact Microsoft had their own browser scripting language, called VBScript. It was released in 1996 and only ran (runs) on Internet Explorer browsers (client-side) and Windows as an interpreter (Wscript.exe). I ended-up using it extensively for a period of time from 1998 to 2002 to automate webpages that only ran in the intranet. I also used Wscript to run certain OLE or ODBC based automation (ie. grab data from Excel and write to a file) that was clunky to write in Perl. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VBScript https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VBScript
- DonHopkins 6y ago
  Now look at what's become of Sun's trademarked logo: Zuckerberg’s not-so-subtle message to Facebook employees: Don’t end up like Sun Microsystems Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg has put a pretty hefty reminder for Facebook employees to keep striving for relevancy right outside the front door. An aging Sun Microsystems sign, on the back side of the Facebook sign, is a well-placed message to them. https://www.geekwire.com/2014/zuckerbergs-not-subtle-message-facebook-employees-dont-end-like-sun-microsystems/ https://www.geekwire.com/2014/zuckerbergs-not-subtle-message...
flowerlad 6y ago
Remember, Sun needed Netscape to make Java successful. Today Java is a server-side technology, but that's not how it started its life. Java started its life as a technology to build more powerful web pages (using embedded applets). Sun needed Netscape to bundle Java into its browser. So if Netscape wanted to leverage the hype that existed around Java at that time then Sun had to let them.
- pjmlp 6y ago
  They also needed Oracle and IBM, their two major partners in the early Java days.
- alasdair_ 6y ago
  >Java started its life as a technology to build more powerful web pages I'm pretty sure Java came from the work James Gosling did on Oak, which was mostly used for embedded systems. I remember a lot of the early documentation being OO designs for devices like microwaves and CD players.
  - flowerlad 6y ago
    > I'm pretty sure Java came from the work James Gosling did on Oak, which was mostly used for embedded systems. Yes, when it was conceived it was indeed intended for embedded systems but when it was released it was intended as a tech for building client-side smarts into web pages. Java was originally conceived as Sun's response to General Magic's intelligent agent technology. Microsoft's response to General Magic was Microsoft Bob, because they saw General Magic's social interface as a threat to Windows.

Sun was literally in on it though? So it'd be like if whoever was announcing this hypothetical C#Script was doing so together with Microsoft..

m_st 6y ago

According to the interview with Eich linked above: "Bill Joy at Sun was the champion of it, which was very helpful because that’s how we got the name." Sure helps :-)

astura 6y ago

Netscape had permission from Sun to use the "Java" name, it was a partnership. This press release itself even says it in the first sentence >Netscape Communications Corporation (NASDAQ: NSCP) and Sun Microsystems, Inc. (NASDAQ:SUNW), today announced JavaScript

acdha 6y ago

This was voluntary. You have to remember that at the time the residing hype kings were the so-called 4GLs (e.g. Clarion, Clipper, PowerBuilder) and things like Visual Basic, Pascal (Delphi), etc. so Sun and Netscape were trying to present this as the pair of languages which you used to build the web, which was already emerging as the white-hot new thing starting to transform the world.

ajuc 6y ago
Such a shame Clipper and Delphi didn't worked out. In early 90s my uncle (now 60 years old electrical engineer) taught himself clipper from 0 (no programming background whatsoever, and no English language) and wrote a software for capturing and analysing temperature curves of polymer ovens at a factory where he works that is still used to this day. They keep a DOS PC just to run it :) I don't think it's possible to do this with modern programming technology, there's too many layers of abstraction and unrelated asides blocking people from "just making it work".
- 725686 6y ago
  My older brother still maintains clipper code that is used in production.
- pjmlp 6y ago
  Delphi is still around, and there is a striving community in Germany, big enough to keep conferences and magazines going. But yeah, Borland really messed up.

bluedino 6y ago

Nobody outside of developers knows what C# is, though. Java was one of the biggest buzzwords of the late 90's.

identity0 6y ago
That's true, it's more like naming your language "BlockchainScript". I could totally see someone doing that today.
- JackFr 6y ago
  "Scrypto"
- cozzyd 6y ago
  I just checked and bitcoinscript.org seems to be owned by a domain parker.
  - Arnavion 6y ago
    Bitcoin already has a script (it's what transactions are made of) so that's not unexpected.

jen20 6y ago

scripts [1] suggests this has not been the case! [1]: https://github.com/scriptcs/scriptcs https://github.com/scriptcs/scriptcs

hajile 6y ago

Everything was fine because Sun owned the Javascript trademark. Oracle now owns that trademark today https://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=75026640&caseType=SERIAL_NO&searchType=statusSearch https://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=75026640&caseType=SERIAL_... For what it's worth, Microsoft lost a lawsuit over their Java clone called J. Their Javascript clone was called JScript. They made .net and C# instead and probably would have tried to make a new web language except that there was no room. One could argue that that VB.net was that language to some degree.

ojosilva 6y ago
In fact Microsoft had their own browser scripting language, called VBScript. It was released in 1996 and only ran (runs) on Internet Explorer browsers (client-side) and Windows as an interpreter (Wscript.exe). I ended-up using it extensively for a period of time from 1998 to 2002 to automate webpages that only ran in the intranet. I also used Wscript to run certain OLE or ODBC based automation (ie. grab data from Excel and write to a file) that was clunky to write in Perl. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VBScript https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VBScript
DonHopkins 6y ago
Now look at what's become of Sun's trademarked logo: Zuckerberg’s not-so-subtle message to Facebook employees: Don’t end up like Sun Microsystems Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg has put a pretty hefty reminder for Facebook employees to keep striving for relevancy right outside the front door. An aging Sun Microsystems sign, on the back side of the Facebook sign, is a well-placed message to them. https://www.geekwire.com/2014/zuckerbergs-not-subtle-message-facebook-employees-dont-end-like-sun-microsystems/ https://www.geekwire.com/2014/zuckerbergs-not-subtle-message...

flowerlad 6y ago

Remember, Sun needed Netscape to make Java successful. Today Java is a server-side technology, but that's not how it started its life. Java started its life as a technology to build more powerful web pages (using embedded applets). Sun needed Netscape to bundle Java into its browser. So if Netscape wanted to leverage the hype that existed around Java at that time then Sun had to let them.

pjmlp 6y ago
They also needed Oracle and IBM, their two major partners in the early Java days.
alasdair_ 6y ago
>Java started its life as a technology to build more powerful web pages I'm pretty sure Java came from the work James Gosling did on Oak, which was mostly used for embedded systems. I remember a lot of the early documentation being OO designs for devices like microwaves and CD players.
- flowerlad 6y ago
  > I'm pretty sure Java came from the work James Gosling did on Oak, which was mostly used for embedded systems. Yes, when it was conceived it was indeed intended for embedded systems but when it was released it was intended as a tech for building client-side smarts into web pages. Java was originally conceived as Sun's response to General Magic's intelligent agent technology. Microsoft's response to General Magic was Microsoft Bob, because they saw General Magic's social interface as a threat to Windows.